18 holes
- Thread starter bcoak
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Precision iron play is the key to going low though; no one wants to be scrambling around for a decent score if they can avoid it.
And my theory is if your path and impact are working well for the long game, its a fair bet that you won't be struggling too much for feel with the short shots either.
Putting sure. But if you're having a lot of 3 putts its more than likely cos you're hitting it 40ft to the wrong side of the green.
And my theory is if your path and impact are working well for the long game, its a fair bet that you won't be struggling too much for feel with the short shots either.
Putting sure. But if you're having a lot of 3 putts its more than likely cos you're hitting it 40ft to the wrong side of the green.
JEREMY5577
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The problem is it's too hard to focus on short game when in the back of your mind your thinking about the full swing. I love practicing short game when I'm hitting it well.
jenhaoyen
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same with putting
Kevin Shields
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I would counter this by saying if you had a great short game it would help you not think about the full swing so much. It takes the pressure off the long game. However, I totally understand the desire to tighten up the full swing. I guess Im getting a little tired of talking to players you want to "make it" but simply refuse to put in the time from 75 yds and in. Unless your full swing is really unworkable, thats where its at
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Id say its more proximity to the hole thats more important than GIRs. Lets say you have a guy whos a fantastic chipper and gets up and down all day because his mediocre ballstriking has him just missing greens. If he tightens up his long game a little, he still shoots around the same score because now hes just 2 putting from 30-40 feet. Or you have a fair ballstriker who hits 2 more greens in reg and goes from 40 feet to 30 feet. Is he gonna make more of those? The score doesnt really go down in my experience.
You have to go from terrible to good in ballstriking to make an impact scorewise. Or short to fairly long to make a score jump. Or if you have a few penalty shots from foul balls, you need to get rid of those. But more GIR? Nothing good chipping and pitching wont cure.Otherwise its 75 yds and in.
So depending on the player, I still think 75 yds and in is the fastest way to lower scores. A good chipper/pitcher/putter has a chance against anybody whereas a bad one has a chance against no one.
You have to go from terrible to good in ballstriking to make an impact scorewise. Or short to fairly long to make a score jump. Or if you have a few penalty shots from foul balls, you need to get rid of those. But more GIR? Nothing good chipping and pitching wont cure.Otherwise its 75 yds and in.
So depending on the player, I still think 75 yds and in is the fastest way to lower scores. A good chipper/pitcher/putter has a chance against anybody whereas a bad one has a chance against no one.
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Brian Manzella
Administrator
Rule #1: Use the bounce!
bcoak
New
One of the big changes I think is everyone grabs a sand wedge for shots. I remember practicing with 6,7,8 iron and getting it on the ground fast. Use the rule; land it 1/3 of the way to hole.
BM, funny, when I think about how to use the bounce and where the club hits my short game improves dramatically
BM, funny, when I think about how to use the bounce and where the club hits my short game improves dramatically
bcoak
New
Luke Donald in GD:
Like a lot of you, I used to think that to get better I needed more distance. In 2006, my game was pretty sharp—I had 10 top 10s in 18 events—but I went out the next year trying to hit the ball harder and got my swing into a bad groove. I started missing more greens and had to rely on my chipping and pitching. That became my new reality.
After a while I stopped obsessing over power, and my game from tee to green really rebounded. That's when everything started to come together. Because of the work I'd put into my short game, I had more shots and more confidence to save par when I did miss a green. But I needed that little distance detour to realize the importance of getting up and down.
Like a lot of you, I used to think that to get better I needed more distance. In 2006, my game was pretty sharp—I had 10 top 10s in 18 events—but I went out the next year trying to hit the ball harder and got my swing into a bad groove. I started missing more greens and had to rely on my chipping and pitching. That became my new reality.
After a while I stopped obsessing over power, and my game from tee to green really rebounded. That's when everything started to come together. Because of the work I'd put into my short game, I had more shots and more confidence to save par when I did miss a green. But I needed that little distance detour to realize the importance of getting up and down.
I have to imagine there are a lot of people like me who aren't obsessed with score but are very interested in becoming a great ballstriker. After all, for most of us it's not like improving our score is a matter of life or death. And didn't Hogan say that putts should count for half a stroke or something? Which is right. I think great ballstrikers deserve a hell of a lot more admiration than players with a great short game.
bcoak
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And scores have not improved in umpteen years.
johnnymarlboro
New
Hogan only said that because he was a terrible putter towards the end though. I see decent ball strikers all the time at the public courses I play. I almost NEVER see people with hot short games. It's not glamorous enough.
I am playing off of a 5 right now, and most of my lost strokes are either around or on the green. IE: poorly executed bunker shot, occasional three putt, birdie putt you should have made, but slightly pulled or pushed, not hitting short pitch shots close enough, etc.
I changed my whole perspective on hitting greens in reg, when a tour pro told me 12 greens in reg, should be an automatic par round. you should get 9 pars, 3 birdies, and get up and down 50% on the six greens you miss.
I think the idea of being Hogan and hitting 18 greens a round, is probably just a pipe dream for most of us. Now for high handicappers, yeah, you need to learn to hit the ball in play.
I changed my whole perspective on hitting greens in reg, when a tour pro told me 12 greens in reg, should be an automatic par round. you should get 9 pars, 3 birdies, and get up and down 50% on the six greens you miss.
I think the idea of being Hogan and hitting 18 greens a round, is probably just a pipe dream for most of us. Now for high handicappers, yeah, you need to learn to hit the ball in play.
Good call, concur with the sentiment.
I think after reaching certain level of proficiency with the long game, much more attention should be paid toward the short game. putting, up and downs and as Kevin suggested, 75 yd in.
I cannot speak for others, but for my kids, a practice session without the driver and long game is like an going to Friendly's with no ice cream. But a practice session without putting to them is not worth a second thought. I am pretty sure they remember vividly for a while if they drive out of bound (thankfully not often), but 3 putts are accepted more readily.
Basically, I am the one at fault. After watching my kids playing in every tournament, I always tell myself that they need to practice putting more and guess what? I never really follow through. Our practice session first stop has always been the range. Then, we squeeze in some putting in the end, when there is time or when they are not too tired.
We have changed the routine to putting first, then short game then range starting this fall. Let's see how it pans out.
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Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
I would argue that it takes more skill to be great from 75 yds and in than it does to be a great ballstriker. The golf world is full of players who are disproportionally good ballstrikers compared to their short games. Thats why they dont make it. The average player will plateau when it comes to ballstriking anyway once the swing DNA is set. You can certainly do things to improve ballstriking for sure but most will reach a certain level and that will be it. You can always add to the short game arsenal because there are sooooo many shots to learn.
And spare me the "Hogan went from bad to great....". He had all the tools in place and got his magic bullet. Anyone who doesnt appreciate the short game and wedges either doesnt have a good short game so they pooh pooh it or, like Lifter said, they just dont care about score.
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Just saying, but if your kids arent learning every single last short game shot right now they will not reach the level you obviously want them too. They need to be snipers from 100 in or they have zero chance.
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
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