Arms Dropping from the top too much

[jewofgolf]

I have working through a number of swing issues over the last few months and I've made a lot of great improvements and things are getting to be pretty solid. There is one issue, however, that persists. My pattern model is NHA 2.0, or very near it.

No matter how little I lift my arms, my hands always want to fall too much straight down. This cramps me, and if from there I keep my arms straight, I hit a snap hook. So, of course I let my arms bend because there is no room and I don't have a good move.

I'm debating my next step:
1) Stick something behind me to literally force me to move the club onto the plane (carry and drop the sugar)
2) Swing back flatter to match my arms and shoulders, because presumably my arms want to get lined up with my shoulders (that's what it looks like on video)
3) Turn my shoulders even steeper so that my natural arm swing matches my shoulders.

I can try as hard as I can to carry my hands over, but dang if they just want to keep on falling straight down.

Thanks in advance!

 

[mgranato]

I can sell you some of my carry.

 

[jewofgolf]

Yesterday was interesting - I took an old shaft and a shortened pool noodle with me and stuck it in the underplane position. I had to swing over it...whiffed once and many other odd shots, but I started to get the feeling. Definitely there is a different pivot to support that club in that position as opposed to way underplane.

This feeling is so wierd though because for so long I've just directed my whole swing left with the club underneath, as opposed to getting it on plane correctly from the top.

In NHA 2.0 Brian has the hands lifting for sure, so I think I'm okay with a little bit of the hands above the right shoulder as opposed to no lift. I don't want them too high though as it's easy to drop them down too much, though.

 

[hp12c]

Have u tried the towel as a plane board? I think its in NHA.

 

[jewofgolf]

Yes, I did set up a plane board with a foam noodle. Maybe it wasn't tall enough? I was able to miss the foam, maybe by just directing my whole motion left. I tried with that for a few weeks before deciding to try this new way.

 

[Lifter]

Rotate like Garrigus

(1) Higher hands at the top encourages less arm drop.

(2) On the downswing, if you slide toward the target less, your arms will fall behind your body less.

(3) Look at Robert Garrigus's swing:

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/35DXmhTjYEg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/dEeqB609T1s" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

He has VIOLENT chest rotation through impact! That discourages the arms from dropping. Personally, I try to get that chest rotation by trying to hit a screaming line drive foul ball way way way way left into the bleachers.

 

[jenhaoyen]

 

[jewofgolf]

Thanks for the responses guys. I will work on the shoulder turn aspect along with continuing to take my hands around the obstacle.

 

[wulsy]

Thanks for the responses guys. I will work on the shoulder turn aspect along with continuing to take my hands around the obstacle.

Try flatter/lower arms at the top.

 

[jewofgolf]

Try flatter/lower arms at the top.

Yes it made sense to me that if I keep them lower, it's harder to drop them. It's kind of hard for me to execute, but I'm including it as part of this process. Thank you!

 

[jewofgolf]

So I just hit some balls trying to put all of these thoughts together. I had no video this time. The shoulder turn thing sort of puts it all together. Before I was trying to carry the unit with my hands, which doesn't work apparently. By really feeling a big shoulder turn, I was also better able to turn my hips. One thought that really made sense was "pivot powered, hands controlled pivot", like in CFF.

I hit a bunch of thin ones, fat ones, plenty of push slices (body not turning through), but finally it made some sense...not this mystical thing of "how do I get this club to stay on plane?". So, thanks so far to those posting thoughts and videos.

Anyone else who has advice for NHA pattern and my dropping the club down (instead of carrying it across), please chime in.

 

[jewofgolf]

Yesterday, it occurred to me that if I think about keeping my left shoulder as low as possible for as long as possible, it would benefit my move.

Also, regarding my hands - I want to get them high with a steep shoulder turn, but not with a lifting motion. I mean to say, my hands should be lowish in relation to my shoulder plane, but still high due to the steeper NHA 2.0 shoulder turn.

 

[hp12c]

So I just hit some balls trying to put all of these thoughts together. I had no video this time. The shoulder turn thing sort of puts it all together. Before I was trying to carry the unit with my hands, which doesn't work apparently. By really feeling a big shoulder turn, I was also better able to turn my hips. One thought that really made sense was "pivot powered, hands controlled pivot", like in CFF.

I hit a bunch of thin ones, fat ones, plenty of push slices (body not turning through), but finally it made some sense...not this mystical thing of "how do I get this club to stay on plane?". So, thanks so far to those posting thoughts and videos.

Anyone else who has advice for NHA pattern and my dropping the club down (instead of carrying it across), please chime in.

Hey jewofgolf on the NHA vid if I remember correctly Brian wants the the hips with very little hipturn, a sliding motion away fom the target to get the weight off the left foot, also check your set up, more level shoulder and slightly open to target, mid body hand at address with the all too important Manzella nuetral grip.

 

[jewofgolf]

Hey jewofgolf on the NHA vid if I remember correctly Brian wants the the hips with very little hipturn, a sliding motion away fom the target to get the weight off the left foot, also check your set up, more level shoulder and slightly open to target, mid body hand at address with the all too important Manzella nuetral grip.

1) Sliding shoulder turn - yes this is exactly what I meant by steeper shoulder turn
2) Definitely open and more level, but I do tilt some (because I will add tilt on the way down otherwise)
3) Grip is WEAK, zero knuckles of left hand.

I went to hit some at lunch...the feeling of keeping the left shoulder low and using standard hip action...wow I finally hit some solid shots today. I think I'm finally getting the carry move and drop/shake the sugar. There is a delay (for me) - a period where I'm just going low and left with my shoulders, hips, everything going low and left (feeling to me). Until I let that delay happen, I can't shake the sugar and swing it left.

That Robert Garrigus video was extremely helpful in making this connection thus far.

 

[hp12c]

1) Sliding shoulder turn - yes this is exactly what I meant by steeper shoulder turn
2) Definitely open and more level, but I do tilt some (because I will add tilt on the way down otherwise)
3) Grip is WEAK, zero knuckles of left hand.

I went to hit some at lunch...the feeling of keeping the left shoulder low and using standard hip action...wow I finally hit some solid shots today. I think I'm finally getting the carry move and drop/shake the sugar. There is a delay (for me) - a period where I'm just going low and left with my shoulders, hips, everything going low and left (feeling to me). Until I let that delay happen, I can't shake the sugar and swing it left.

That Robert Garrigus video was extremely helpful in making this connection thus far.

If you do the hurdle drill and place another ball in front about a grips lenght away from the ball you are adressing. Adress the first ball the one u would normally strike,but you want to miss this one and strike the one in front, the one a grips lenght away. You may notice from the BS your transtition move will be a hips and shoulder motion in unision to the right or counterclockwise move with your arms for lack of a better word frozen or just old em where they are untill u feel youre almost facing the target then shake the sugar on top of the ball.

 

[jewofgolf]

If you do the hurdle drill and place another ball in front about a grips lenght away from the ball you are adressing. Adress the first ball the one u would normally strike,but you want to miss this one and strike the one in front, the one a grips lenght away. You may notice from the BS your transtition move will be a hips and shoulder motion in unision to the right or counterclockwise move with your arms for lack of a better word frozen or just old em where they are untill u feel youre almost facing the target then shake the sugar on top of the ball.

Thanks hp12c. I never thought to actually hit a ball using the hurdle drill. I will try that and report back when I practice again.

 

[hp12c]

Thanks hp12c. I never thought to actually hit a ball using the hurdle drill. I will try that and report back when I practice again.

I pulled the first dozen mean left and I mean left, make sure you have a clear zone way left. But slowly the balls started going right and I mean right.

 

[jewofgolf]

So, I feel like at a minimum, I understand the upper body feeling. Keeping a very low left shoulder seems to get me on plane until....my pivot stops. I figured it out - I get onto the outside of my left foot, and then I can no longer make my hips turn...so I make this stupid jumping move and get into my toes.

I tried flaring my left foot and also widening the left foot in my stance. When doing these things, I no longer jumped, but I ended up losing the shots weakly to the right.

I have 4 days until my next round - suggestions for getting a better hip action & pivot move? I can get 4-6 30 minute sessions with video feedback over this time period. I don't mind struggling heavily (I have for the past 2 months - no giving in and going back to my bad swing) - so lay ideas out there.

 

[magicmarker]

what is the right heel doing?

 

[jewofgolf]

When I earnestly try to keep it down, it stays down - meaning I don't get right onto the toe - meaning it gets slowly lifted as weight transfers through the instep. That's when I lose it way right - presumably because everything else is doing what it's supposed to and I'm not turning the unit with my lower body.