Custom Fitting
- Thread starter T_Dog
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Agree 100% with Ringer. My iron misses are mostly over the top. I adjusted the stiffness and kick point of my stafts and now that miss is 10 yards long and left, not 20+, and I hit my good shots the same. The science of spin rate and launch angle is just that, science. It is not a simple as loooking at numbers on a screen and handing someone a club that matches, but a good club fitter will improve the fit of your clubs for you by a wide margin, unless you got lucky and randomly bought clubs that fit you well.
Bill Miracle
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Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
Tomayto - Tomato.
It's important to a point and gets more important as your swing becomes more consistent. But keep in mind that increases/decreases in swing speed, changes in tempo/release points, plane angle you choose to swing on will all determine a proper fit of any club.
However even then, it's still the golfers choice. I don't necessarily have to be playing X100s, i could play S300s without a problem. But with the S300 i draw the ball a bit more than i want so i play X100s.
tongzilla
New
But it's the guy with the 85mph driver swing who wants to play the stiffest nanotechnology shaft he can find that is going to inhibit his swing. You can probably do most golfers a great service by keeping the club length shorter rather than longer (driver especially) and keeping the shaft weaker than stronger all other things being equal. A good clubfitter can tighten the fit even more.
A highly skilled player may have a real sensitive sense of feel which is why it probably took Tom W so long to get Payne's clubs exactly right.
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
I have helped my friend fit players from super high handicappers to low handicappers. There is really no general rule. Some 90mph players need a strong stiff because of tempo and release while another could have played an regular flex.
I've seen people become more accurate using LONGER drivers than shorter ones. In the end it's up to the golfer to find what they are the most confident with.
I would say that higher handicaps will benefit best from the proper length and lie angle the most with a shaft flex in the "range" of where they should be. Once their swing becomes more consistent you can tweak more.
I don't really disagree - there are always exceptions to the rule but you can help a lot of them with those simple rules and like you say tweak later.
I'm not sure I could envision too many of the 90mph stiff shaft guys - if they've got a fast tempo their release would be poorly timed to only get 90mph unless they've got a Dana Quigley type of swing. But, everyone seems to have an example of a fit where the numbers say one thing but the results say something else.
Bill,
I made the shafts stiffer and the kick point higher. The kick point is mostly for feel purposes. The stiffer shaft dampens the impact of the big pull hook my particular over the top move led to with the softer shafts.
I disagree a little with Jim's view that it is "up to the golfer to find what they are the most confident with." I beleive that with the heads, but not the shafts. I think it is up to the club fitter to combine the science of club fitting with the art of matching the technology to the player's swing and tendencies to maximize the results of a club fitting. A lot of people might feel confident with a Graphite Design YS-7+ shaft in their driver, but it doesn't make it a good fit for anyone unless they have a great pivot (and the corresponding swing speed resulting therefrom). That said, if you don't feel comfortable looking down at the club, you are cooked. So confidence should factor into the clubhead selection much more than the shaft selection, in my opinion. For example, the Hi-Bore XL looks good for me on the computer, but my mind's eye cannot get comfortable with the look of that head.
I made the shafts stiffer and the kick point higher. The kick point is mostly for feel purposes. The stiffer shaft dampens the impact of the big pull hook my particular over the top move led to with the softer shafts.
I disagree a little with Jim's view that it is "up to the golfer to find what they are the most confident with." I beleive that with the heads, but not the shafts. I think it is up to the club fitter to combine the science of club fitting with the art of matching the technology to the player's swing and tendencies to maximize the results of a club fitting. A lot of people might feel confident with a Graphite Design YS-7+ shaft in their driver, but it doesn't make it a good fit for anyone unless they have a great pivot (and the corresponding swing speed resulting therefrom). That said, if you don't feel comfortable looking down at the club, you are cooked. So confidence should factor into the clubhead selection much more than the shaft selection, in my opinion. For example, the Hi-Bore XL looks good for me on the computer, but my mind's eye cannot get comfortable with the look of that head.
Some Wishon Tips....
In his most recent newsletter, Tom Wishon offered some clubfitting tips for both game improvement and distance that some might find interesting.
http://www.wishongolf.com/etechreport/2007/august/index_dist.html
In his most recent newsletter, Tom Wishon offered some clubfitting tips for both game improvement and distance that some might find interesting.
http://www.wishongolf.com/etechreport/2007/august/index_dist.html
Steve
Can you please expand on this point - why is custom-fitting important?
What does custom-fitting actually accompish?
Also, how are the necessary measurements made when custom-fitting? Does it require sophisticated equipment/know-how?
I now use Taylor Resuce hybrids for my 2,3,4 and 5 irons, and they are NOT custom-fitted. Although I am happy with my performance when using those clubs, would I benefit by having them custom-fitted?
Jeff.
Can you please expand on this point - why is custom-fitting important?
What does custom-fitting actually accompish?
Also, how are the necessary measurements made when custom-fitting? Does it require sophisticated equipment/know-how?
I now use Taylor Resuce hybrids for my 2,3,4 and 5 irons, and they are NOT custom-fitted. Although I am happy with my performance when using those clubs, would I benefit by having them custom-fitted?
Jeff.
Lets first start with probably the most common issue I find. The clubs are not uniform through the whole set. So the flex in your wedge is different from the flex in your 3 wood. Potentially you could have 13 different flexes, lie angles, length variations...etc. (everything should be on a gradient) So therefor a person would have to learn 13 different ways to swing the club. Imagine the confusion. You can see this all the time. How many players have you seen miss one way with their long irons and the complete opposite with their short irons. But most people don't pay attention enough to recognize this pattern. Most only recognize the shot they just played, then try to adjust to it.
So follow this scenario... Player tee's off with driver and hangs it out right because the shaft is too flexible. "Well dangit, wait for the clubhead." Player puches out from trees or sand. Sets up for the third shot with their 8 iron still remembering the shot off the tee, tries to be more patient for the clubhead and giant pull hook left over the green.
I see this scenario play out in varying ways ALL THE TIME. Swing, adjust... that adjustment to a different club causes a different type of poor shot... adjust again, causes different type of poor shot again.. adjust... swing... different club.. adjust.. swing.. on and on and on.
As for how we go through a fitting, I have some basics called the 6 L's. There are other variables that must be looked at but in general these 6 are all you need.
Length
Loft
Lie Angle
Loading of the shaft (flex)
Lightness (weight)
Looks
Grip size and type, kick point, offset or not... can also be considered but i'm still trying to work on how I can start those with "L" to make it fit.
Jeff, you may not need to change the hybrids, but if you feel so comfortable hitting those clubs, ask why you aren't as comfortable hitting all your other clubs.
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