Everything on the toe?

[shortgamer]

I've added 10 strokes to my handicap in ten days and can't figure out why. Everthing is off the toe. I even tried a bandaid of standing closer and still did it. When I say toe I mean the part of the iron with no grooves.Ball flight is straight just weak.Is there a usual suspect?

 

[Perfect Impact]

Yes. If your upper body is tilted too far forward, and/or your hands are too far from your legs FOR THE NATURAL PATH OF YOUR CLUBHEAD TO MEET THE BALL in your present posture, CHANGE YOUR POSTURE; DO NOT try to change your path. Your path is a function of the relationship of your upper arms to your chest, of gravity acting on your arms, and of the angle of your chest relative to the ground.

Standing closer by itself won't fix it: stand more ERECT as well, and if your hands are not close enough to your legs at setup, you WILL often or always hit on the toe.

It is not the ONLY possible explanation; it is only 95% of them.

 

[shortgamer]

In my lesson with brian he said I had really low hands at setup and I've always been pretty erect at setup(no jokes). I was just swinging in the backyard and I think I'm rising up out of my posture on the backswing.Could that be it? At simulated impact I've found myself darn near standing straight up.I've got axis tilt still but standing up.

 

[Perfect Impact]

In my lesson with brian he said I had really low hands at setup and I've always been pretty erect at setup(no jokes). I was just swinging in the backyard and I think I'm rising up out of my posture on the backswing.Could that be it? At simulated impact I've found myself darn near standing straight up.I've got axis tilt still but standing up.

Going TO a low-hands-at-setup does increase, for many, the tendency to hit on the toe. For this reason: the geometry changes from that to high-hands-at impact. Not because YOU try to raise them, but because centrifugal force pulls the left armclub to a straighter line than exists with low-hands-at-setup. Look at downtheline pics of virtually ANY golfer and his hands are higher at impact than at setup.

The effect of too low hands is the NECESSITY to raise up during the swing to avoid hitting fat and on the toe. And for an additional reason to the one above: It is the fact that the arm "remembers" its setup distance relative to the legs and returns there, but with the club angle more straightened (i.e., with the wrists more uncocked), the clubhead will arrive closer to his feet than it was with low hands at setup.

I call that low hands setup thingee leaving slack in the measurer. When you measure to the ball with a somewhat acute angle there but strike the ball with a much less acute angle (wrists uncocked), the distance from your left shoulder to the clubhead is longer - possibly by several inches. So the golfer unconsciously, OR consciously, MUST move back up and away to keep from fatting the ground. In the process he also moves his hands further back--closer to his feet. Hence the toe impacts.

I have my pupils with such a problem to remove the slack at setup (you may have noticed how Juli Inkster and Nancy Lopez do this in their just-before-takeaway 'standing up' move.) Some golfers ARRIVE AT setup with that slack already removed (Couples).

So measuring to the ball must take into account the elongation that occurs during the impact interval when slack existed at setup, as well as the natural and athletic path the hands "like to travel" in front of the body, which is CLOSE TO IT.

B. Nelson was it, ? - who said "you cannot stand too close to the ball!!!!" While literally untrue, it says a lot, and it comes from someone who would be expected to know.

So if you ARE close where you need to be, be sure to remove the slack before swinging so that you do NOT have to "pull up" to keep from fatting.

Make sense?

 

[Brian Manzella]

The REAL reason(s).

In my lesson with brian he said I had really low hands at setup and I've always been pretty erect at setup(no jokes). I was just swinging in the backyard and I think I'm rising up out of my posture on the backswing.Could that be it? At simulated impact I've found myself darn near standing straight up.I've got axis tilt still but standing up.

When you have low hands you CAN stand farther from the ball and make contact on the grooves.

When I made your hands HIGHER your REACH became shorter.

Ditto with more erect posture.

BUT!

More importantly, when you have the correct hand alignments, i.e. "impact hands"—Flat left wrist and bent right wrist—you also REDUCE YOUR EFFECTIVE REACH as compared to FLIP HANDS.

This is what IMPACT FIX is for.

So, address the ball and then MOVE TO THE EXACT IMPACT POSITION YOU WANT TO ACHIEVE—every little part—and then you will be the correct distance, and you can swing trying to PASS THOUGH THAT SAME LOCATION on the way to the finish.

 

[Dustin]

When you have low hands you CAN stand farther from the ball and make contact on the grooves.

More importantly, when you have the correct hand alignments, i.e. "impact hands"—Flat left wrist and bent right wrist—you also REDUCE YOUR EFFECTIVE REACH as compared to FLIP HANDS.

This is what IMPACT FIX is for.

So, address the ball and then MOVE TO THE EXACT IMPACT POSITION YOU WANT TO ACHIEVE—every little part—and then you will be the correct distance, and you can swing trying to PASS THOUGH THAT SAME LOCATION on the way to the finish.

Very interesting...I've often felt as I've gotten better at impact, I've felt I needed to get closer to the ball than when I flip the club. Thats very helpful to know that makes sense!

 

[Perfect Impact]

When there is excess slack even with a correct impact fix -- where the hands are too far from the legs, pullaway will also cause toe impacts.

Pullaway is the phenomenon of the fact that the left shoulder is not at setup or even impact fix position AT impact; it is FURTHER, higher, from the ball and the ground. It is the reason Daly, Donald, and hundreds of tour players place the teed ball at the heel of the club at setup, not at the SS. Fuzzy Zoeller is the poster boy for this adjustment with HIS clubhead inches further away from his feet than the ball; his shoulder turn, as Daly wrote in his book, is the reason the club is brought back to center.

 

[EdZ]

Impact fix is certainly a critical thing to check for this. Also, check that your plane angle hasn't gotten too steep, and/or that your clubs lie angle fits you properly.

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

When there is excess slack even with a correct impact fix -- where the hands are too far from the legs, pullaway will also cause toe impacts.

Pullaway is the phenomenon of the fact that the left shoulder is not at setup or even impact fix position AT impact; it is FURTHER, higher, from the ball and the ground. It is the reason Daly, Donald, and hundreds of tour players place the teed ball at the heel of the club at setup, not at the SS. Fuzzy Zoeller is the poster boy for this adjustment with HIS clubhead inches further away from his feet than the ball; his shoulder turn, as Daly wrote in his book, is the reason the club is brought back to center.

It's there preference, if anything with a tee'd ball you should have it more towards the toe. If you line up the drive with it on the ground anyway.