How to cure the "slack"

[Ringer]

For as long as I can remember I have had a great looking "pivot" both back and through, but my arms are constantly behind in the race. I've had an over the top move for as long as I've had a club in my hand which I make up for with a nifty little arm action. It squares the face more often than not but always find myself in trouble right. The sole of my club tends to dig the toe into the ground and I'm often pulling divots left.

The only "cure" I've ever been able to come up with is shortening the back-swing. I feel this is really unnecessary and I should be able to turn as much as I want so long as I don't lose balance.

Am I really doomed to hitting 3/4 shots for the rest of my life or is there something I can do to get the club back on plane?

FWIW, if you want to see the swing it's linked here:

http://www.swingacademy.com/videoPlayer.aspx?id=4609

 

[lookingtolearn]

After the takeaway (either body-driven or hand-driven), use your hands to pull your body to the top, pulling out all the slack along the way.

The "desired location" of the hands during this process will depend on the pattern. I recommend first trying the Soft Draw hand location, which would be as "in" as possible, as far away from the ball as you can get them.

 

[vjsinger]

I wonder what steeper shoulder turn, inside hand path, and straightening of the back knee in the backswing would do for you??

 

[Kevin Shields]

I wonder what steeper shoulder turn, inside hand path, and straightening of the back knee in the backswing would do for you??

Alot...and getting the left knee to turn behind the ball. Good eye. Although Im not sure 100% about the steeper shoulders.

 

[Ringer]

I wonder what steeper shoulder turn, inside hand path, and straightening of the back knee in the backswing would do for you??

I am curious what benefits you think I could gain by doing those?

 

[holeout]

I am curious what benefits you think I could gain by doing those?

My guess is that it seems like you trap the left arm against your chest pretty hard on the downswing, forcing you to work under it coming down with a left arm wedge struggling to turn back to the ball (hence, OTT and fade). This, I think, is because of an over-rotated left arm wedge and not enough pivot on the backswing (which in itself may have caused the over-rotation). More inside hand path and straighter back knee would get you some more hip turn going back (which by itself would give you more inside hands), less left-arm wedge rotation, and allow your pivot to sequence better so you wouldn't get your left arm so far against your chest at the top.

Make sense? You have a similar problem to a lot of guys on here (myself included). Years of hearing the "benefits" of a restricted hip turn/pivot on the backswing is the culprit, I think.

 

[Matt 4-L]

My guess is that it seems like you trap the left arm against your chest pretty hard on the downswing, forcing you to work under it coming down with a left arm wedge struggling to turn back to the ball (hence, OTT and fade). This, I think, is because of an over-rotated left arm wedge and not enough pivot on the backswing (which in itself may have caused the over-rotation). More inside hand path and straighter back knee would get you some more hip turn going back (which by itself would give you more inside hands), less left-arm wedge rotation, and allow your pivot to sequence better so you wouldn't get your left arm so far against your chest at the top.

Make sense? You have a similar problem to a lot of guys on here (myself included). Years of hearing the "benefits" of a restricted hip turn/pivot on the backswing is the culprit, I think.

+1

 

[vjsinger]

My guess is that it seems like you trap the left arm against your chest pretty hard on the downswing, forcing you to work under it coming down with a left arm wedge struggling to turn back to the ball (hence, OTT and fade). This, I think, is because of an over-rotated left arm wedge and not enough pivot on the backswing (which in itself may have caused the over-rotation). More inside hand path and straighter back knee would get you some more hip turn going back (which by itself would give you more inside hands), less left-arm wedge rotation, and allow your pivot to sequence better so you wouldn't get your left arm so far against your chest at the top.

Make sense? You have a similar problem to a lot of guys on here (myself included). Years of hearing the "benefits" of a restricted hip turn/pivot on the backswing is the culprit, I think.

I couldn't have said it better! I'd like to see the steeper shoulder turn just to see if it gives you the feel of "torque" towards the top that it seems you are seeking. I think your obviously a good enough player to know where to put the power package on the way down so don't think the steeper shoulders would hurt.

 

[cmartingolf]

I wonder what steeper shoulder turn, inside hand path, and straightening of the back knee in the backswing would do for you??

V, I'm with you...

Ringer, I like your action. I'm not seeing a "slack" issue at all.

 

[cmartingolf]

My guess is that it seems like you trap the left arm against your chest pretty hard on the downswing, forcing you to work under it coming down with a left arm wedge struggling to turn back to the ball (hence, OTT and fade). This, I think, is because of an over-rotated left arm wedge and not enough pivot on the backswing (which in itself may have caused the over-rotation). More inside hand path and straighter back knee would get you some more hip turn going back (which by itself would give you more inside hands), less left-arm wedge rotation, and allow your pivot to sequence better so you wouldn't get your left arm so far against your chest at the top.

Make sense? You have a similar problem to a lot of guys on here (myself included). Years of hearing the "benefits" of a restricted hip turn/pivot on the backswing is the culprit, I think.

Awesome Post!!!

 

[Ringer]

My guess is that it seems like you trap the left arm against your chest pretty hard on the downswing, forcing you to work under it coming down with a left arm wedge struggling to turn back to the ball (hence, OTT and fade). This, I think, is because of an over-rotated left arm wedge and not enough pivot on the backswing (which in itself may have caused the over-rotation). More inside hand path and straighter back knee would get you some more hip turn going back (which by itself would give you more inside hands), less left-arm wedge rotation, and allow your pivot to sequence better so you wouldn't get your left arm so far against your chest at the top.

Make sense? You have a similar problem to a lot of guys on here (myself included). Years of hearing the "benefits" of a restricted hip turn/pivot on the backswing is the culprit, I think.

Thank you greatly for the explanation Holeout. I am curious how you came to the conclusion that the hands aren't coming inside enough or that my shoulders aren't turning enough. When I look at my takeaway it looks like my hands are coming inside and my shoulder turn seems very full. My left shoulder is all the way back over my back foot.

I think you're right about the left wedge. The club seems laid off once I get past hip high. I've always been told my right elbow gets below my left too soon in the back-swing.

 

[holeout]

Hands not coming inside enough I deduced mostly from the over-rotated left arm wedge. However, the real culprit is that you start back with mostly just your hands/arms. There's no early pivot in the backswing, which naturally will cause the hands to move outside rather than in. Simply moving the hands more "in" on the takeaway isn't the real fix; it's only good if you add the earlier hip turn.

I never said your shoulders aren't turning enough. You might end up with more turn at the end of this, but I'd say it's mostly the timing of the turn that you've got out of whack. The arms are pulling your shoulders to the top. Think of it like a pitcher stretching his arm back to start his wind-up. Not pretty.

I think you need to feel much more like the clubhead is stuck in the ground and you've got to pull it out with your pivot to start the backswing. You may need some downswing adjustments as well, but this is a start.

Get us some new video too!

 

[duckjr78]

Thank you greatly for the explanation Holeout. I am curious how you came to the conclusion that the hands aren't coming inside enough or that my shoulders aren't turning enough. When I look at my takeaway it looks like my hands are coming inside and my shoulder turn seems very full. My left shoulder is all the way back over my back foot.

I think you're right about the left wedge. The club seems laid off once I get past hip high. I've always been told my right elbow gets below my left too soon in the back-swing.

Ringer,

Can you give an update of how this is going? I believe I have a similar issue with "slack." The better I feel my pivot on the downswing, the more I feel my hands/arms trailing and feel like I need to cast to catch up.

 

[Ringer]

Ringer,

Can you give an update of how this is going? I believe I have a similar issue with "slack." The better I feel my pivot on the downswing, the more I feel my hands/arms trailing and feel like I need to cast to catch up.

Yeah, I went and had a lesson with a professional I've known a long time and is an excellent player. (Southwest section Senior player of the year 2009)

He had me do 2 things. Open the face more going back and more around my shoulders, then drive with the legs.

After one week of working on this I hit 16 greens and 9 of 12 fairways. Those that I missed were all just within a few feet of making the green or fairway. By far the best ball striking day of my life.

Since then I have not had the same phenomenal striking, but I certainly control the clubface better and can hit a draw without any changes in setup, just swing.