Inside aft quadrant ??!!!

[horton]

brianman::

Can you explain to me why no significant sidespin is generated when the ball is struck on the inside aft quadrant with an open clubface?

Even if the clubhead is tracking on-line, this open clubface must create force vectors that will send the ball side-spinning regardless of the vertical path.

What do you know that I don't know? Thanks.

 

[Brian Manzella]

Horton.

Ever hit a ball with a plane board in place??

Very difficult to NOT hit the inside-aft quadrant.

I will show you a picture...

 

[Brian Manzella]

What this pic shows is that Brian Manzella can do 'experiments' just like the scientists.

This is a board I used as a plane board with a ball I draw on with a sharpie.

The $100 laser is 'shooting' precisely down-plane and look where it hits the ball.

Horton loses again.

 

[Brian Manzella]

Horton.

People are tired of your posts. I need sleep.

But...you ask....

HORTON: "Would you not agree that the plane you show is the path the hosel of the club will follow until final Release, and at Impact the Sweet Spot will strike the ball somewhere in it's aft hemisphere?"

The Plane could be either...doesn't mater in this regard. The palne of either is LOOKING at the inside-aft quadrant.


HORTON: "How can you maintain a linear path on an unyielding plane in the downswing, when it is proven that the hand path and clubhead path are curvilinear in everybody's swing. There is no such thing as rigid downswing plane in a real life golfswing."

I can hit balls all day with a plane board and stick on either side. Your scientist have NO GOLF TALENT and they are testing HACKERS.

HORTON: "What I am also curious about is how you can sense a 3º open clubface coming into Impact a 100+ mph for the driver and perhaps 90 mph for long irons. With which kinesthetic abilities can you determine that you are achieving this 3º open face? What feedback mechanism do you possess that allows you to duplicate this feat?"

I practice on a $50,000 machine that measures such things.

HORTON: Please keep in mind that the club is freewheeling around the left wrist joint and forearm just before Impact .... so you only have microseconds to consciously apply any force through your arms into the club. That's like trying to say you can manipulate the LOC through the Impact Interval. Not a feasible proposition if you ask me.

I program it all in ahead of time. It's called practice.

Now please, go to sleep.[|)]

 

[Iowagolfpr]

A good player can sense when the clubhead is a couple of degrees off.
A few years ago I was hitting balls into a net. The clubhead was being monitored at impact by a computer system. The operator told me the my clubhead was open 2 to 3 degress at impact. He said the computer showed my shots would go the right. I told him that I didn't care what the computer said about where the ball would end up. I could feel how I was hitting the ball and I knew that the ball would have a little draw.
A degree or two at impact makes a lot of difference a couple of hundred yards out. Good players can't be off a lot at impact. After hitting millions of shots, I agree with Brain. Feel and real can be different. But, I feel like I am hitting from the inside with some clubhead rotation.

 

[Brian Manzella]

You'd better !

 

[kpainter]

quote:Originally posted by brianman

You'd better !

Brian, 1st time posting on your site but I have been lurking for several weeks. I am curious about the plane board in the picture. Is this something that you practise with or have students work with? Is it something that is easily made? Been looking for something that I could practise with to ensure I am on plane during takeaway.

 

[golf_sceptic]

Why no significant sidespin?

---Oops, The following line should read 16.7 Revs Per Second---
Which is 1000 RPM as the original poster said.
How embarassed am I? First post and I bugger it up!
---------------------------------------------------------------

A rotation of 3* in 0.5ms is 16.7 RPM.

How many RPM does it take to move a ball 5 yards in flight?

 

[Brian Manzella]

quote:Originally posted by golf_sceptic

Why no significant sidespin?

A rotation of 3* in 0.5ms is 16.7 RPM.

How many RPM does it take to move a ball 5 yards in flight?

Because the ball is DEFORMED on this face.

 

[Burner]

quote:Originally posted by brianman

quote:Originally posted by golf_sceptic

Why no significant sidespin?

A rotation of 3* in 0.5ms is 16.7 RPM.

How many RPM does it take to move a ball 5 yards in flight?

Because the ball is DEFORMED on this face.

And the line of compression is sustained.

 

[golf_sceptic]

Unfortunately my bogus arithmetic above
got in the way of accurate discussion.

At any rate I should have quoted the
original posting which suggested
that the 3* in 0.5ms was 1000RPM
when I incorrectly tried to correct it.

The 1000RPM figure is correct.
The 3* is correct.

I can only assume at this stage that Brian
and Burner are correct (which I never doubted)
and that only a fraction of the clubface
rotation is transferred to the ball.

Sorry. I'll go and remove the egg from my face now...

 

[golf_sceptic]

Now that I've corrected myself, I'd like to address Horton's
question on his terms with a possible explanation.

Let's take the initial part of the contact with the clubhead moving
straight down the line and the clubface 3* open. This would tend to
produce a clockwise spin (for a right hander). It will of course
take a while for the ball to start spinning clockwise.

At about the same time, the effect of the clubhead closing will
come into effect. This will reduce, stop or even reverse the
earlier effect depending on whether the initial glancing blow
or the clubface rotation have more effect.

The evidence seems to suggest that the two effects more or less cancel
each other out.

I'm sure what actually goes in is more complicated than this, but
it may go some way to an explanation. Only high speed camera
analysis will tell us what actually happens.

I look forward to Brian's figures on sidespin.

 

[mgjordan]

THIS shows why TGM prouces an ON PLANE STROKE with an IN TO OUT IMPACT.

Stroke = on plane
Impact and thrust = in to out

Brian,
This is your best post.