New Release Question

[Blitzpackage569]

Recently I bought and have been practicing this new release style with modest success. However with my short irons I seem to have this issue of hitting a very high flight ball that lacks distance. This is odd because with my wedges I have gained distance, and my longer irons have remained about the same in terms of yardage. To explain it a bit more, with my short irons my arms feel very rubbery and loose after impact, which is not the case for my other clubs.

My question is what could be the cause/ cure of this?

Thanks

 

[bertsmith]

Are your short irons moving to the right, either pushed of fading or both? This could be due to the face open at impact and no ball compression, resulting in loss of distance also.

 

[Blitzpackage569]

Normally they are straight, but when i try and remedy it and get after it a bit more I seem to get on top of it and pull it or catch it thin. I agree its a lack of compression but I don't understand why the feel is different only for the short irons.

 

[SteveT]

Blitzpackage:

So let me get this straight... with your wedges - W/GW/SW/LW you get more distance and presumably the same height..... with your 6/7/8/9-irons you now get higher flight and less distance.... but with your long irons you get the same yardage.

The feedback feel for your short irons is a very rubbery and loose arm feel after impact. What do you feel for your other clubs... a firm and solid arm feel?


My question would be: what is your swing style for these club groupings? Do you have a quiet lower body for your wedges and more torso rotation, while for your long irons you apply a full-blooded full-body swing?

Perhaps you are having difficulty in your short iron swing style because of the transition from quiet to full body swinging?! Just guessing ...!!

 

[Blitzpackage569]

Actually its even more odd then that....With my wedges, say gap for example(52) I am gaining distance from 100 to say 120 but the trajectory is lower say going from a pop up that goes 100 yards to a low spinning shot.

My 4,5,6,7 have shown no gain in distance but the accuracy has improved. The feel for these clubs is almost automatic as ive been golfing for a while now, very solid and connected sort of feel. Conversely, when I finish with my short irons its very rubbery as if im throwing the club into the air.

As for my swing, it is fairly consistent all the way around and I would describe it as a quiet lower body on the take away followed by the hips and out toss starting the down swing. Too say the least its been frustrating to not carry the results with my 52 degree wedge on down through the set...

 

[SteveT]

Blitz: - Your swing situation is quite... scattered. Since you are trying to explain your swing feel feedback subjectively, I would think you might consider getting an objective assessment of your altered swing results. A golf teacher with a Trackman could provide you with objective answers to your situation.

 

[Brian Manzella]

Just got finished a long day of teaching and PROMISE I'll answer this one when I get home in an hour or two.

Not really too happy about Steve's "answers...."

 

[Brian Manzella]

my short irons I seem to have this issue of hitting a very high flight ball that lacks distance. This is odd because with my wedges I have gained distance, and my longer irons have remained about the same in terms of yardage.

Lots of folks that drag the handle, hit the wedges very short. Pretty much because you can over drag a wedge a lot easier than than a longer club.

So, you picked up yardage with the wedge by transferring the kinetic energy you generated INTO the clubhead.

Check.

The problem with your short irons is that you invariably that have lost some forward lean with them. If you would explain in a short paragraph, what you are trying to do exactly, I could help better.

Just know this, you always want a flat left wrist or an even slightly arched one, AT impact.

No matter what.

The rubbery feeling is simply from the "lob shot" impact.

Glad the accuracy is up with the 4 iron through 7 irons.

Awesome.

Until, I hear of you through the ball feels or ideals, I'd probably like you to at least turn your hips earlier in the BACKSWING and make sure you don't start speeding up the lower lever (club) until halfway down.

 

[Blitzpackage569]

Brian,

First off thank you for all of your contributions to the golfing world as well as your quick response to my question. To answer your question ill give a bit of back round info and say that growing up I was taught by a very "feel" and "simplicity" oriented teacher that taught me a shoulders back and through kind of swing. Fast forward to being an adult and the "feel" i attempt to have is a full shoulder turn(shoulder at or behind my chin) without much hip movement in the backswing. Then my downswing has a very connected start, leading with the hips and as of now I try the out toss........however I will admit my out toss is more in just extending my elbow then throwing my wrist out. Coming into impact I try and keep my shoulders "over the ball" as I sometimes have a tendency to get them too open and follow into a thru finish.

I am sure this sounds quite complicated, however im very feel and tempo oriented so the majority of my work thus far has been attempting to ingrain the out toss as well as the new post impact move that you discuss in your most recent video. If any more explanation is needed please feel free to ask and thanks again for your help.

Ben

 

[Blitzpackage569]

Also, just a bit of clarification, I have always had this kind of "pop up" ball flight with my irons but it has never been an issue because the distance I get has been decent......Is the out toss the key to getting rid of this "dragging the clubhead" or are there other remedies as well?

 

[Kevin Shields]

Also, just a bit of clarification, I have always had this kind of "pop up" ball flight with my irons but it has never been an issue because the distance I get has been decent......Is the out toss the key to getting rid of this "dragging the clubhead" or are there other remedies as well?

Could be, IMO depends a lot on your grip type and how long the face stays open in the downswing.

 

[Brian Manzella]

Fast forward to being an adult and the "feel" i attempt to have is a full shoulder turn(shoulder at or behind my chin) without much hip movement in the backswing.

That's why I think you should allow your hips to turn more in the backswing.

The more "X factor stretch" (the difference between the hip and back turns) the harder it is to not tug.

Then my downswing has a very connected start, leading with the hips and as of now I try the out toss........however I will admit my out toss is more in just extending my elbow then throwing my wrist out.

As far as leading with the hips, do you mean as in unwind, or re-centering?

Also, just a bit of clarification, I have always had this kind of "pop up" ball flight with my irons but it has never been an issue because the distance I get has been decent......Is the out toss the key to getting rid of this "dragging the clubhead" or are there other remedies as well?

The "out-toss" is simply a feel or a drill.

It can be done an unlimited number of ways. You say you don;t do the wrist part. Most folks don't need it.

Do you feel like you were a handle-dragger? If so, why?

Could be, IMO depends a lot on your grip type and how long the face stays open in the downswing.

No doubt.

 

[Blitzpackage569]

Sorry if I answer these in reverse, but my grip is overlap with a longer thumb. This has been a recent change has I have been trying to get my lower two fingers to be 90 degrees to the shaft of the club as you talk about in your video.

I feel like I was a handle dragger in the past, as a junior I would fire my hips and delay my shoulders as much as possible which gave me a "stuck" downswing. Now I am very consciously trying to focus on not "tugging", but I struggle with what I should be doing instead. What I attempt to do now is keep my torso and arms connected and fire that elbow so to speak into a full release.

As for my hips, another portion of my junior swing was I had issues "posting up" due to an inflexible hip(used to have a bent knee at impact that had slid forward) I focus on trying to have a combination of a bump and a turn.

Could be, IMO depends a lot on your grip type and how long the face stays open in the downswing.

Can you give a bit of explanation on this?

 

[Kevin Shields]

If your face doesn't lag open in the first move chances are that won't have to be a primary focus. If you tug the handle and the face gets open as e result, a softer fall with a slight push out can help get you behind the face before you go at it

 

[bryan@nobackswing.com]

If your face doesn't lag open in the first move chances are that won't have to be a primary focus. If you tug the handle and the face gets open as e result, a softer fall with a slight push out can help get you behind the face before you go at it

wow, this is exactly what i'm working on. kevin, can you explain "softer fall with a slight push out"?

 

[Kevin Shields]

wow, this is exactly what i'm working on. kevin, can you explain "softer fall with a slight push out"?

Haha...how can you already be working on it but need it explained?? Softer fall just means no tug and not grinding that left foot in the ground until you can get behind the shaft.

 

[Blitzpackage569]

So is it more desirable for the face to be in a more neutral or closed position on the way down?

 

[Brian Manzella]

So is it more desirable for the face to be in a more neutral or closed position on the way down?

EVERY decent player is rotating the clubface closed the whole swing....well, maybe until the swivel.

At the time the club reaches half of its speed—about hip high—the clubface is ~60° open to its instantaneous path.

That's a lot less then it was at the top or the change of directions.

 

[bryan@nobackswing.com]

Haha...how can you already be working on it but need it explained?? Softer fall just means no tug and not grinding that left foot in the ground until you can get behind the shaft.

thanks kevin, i just meant that i felt like i am working on a similar feeling, but appreciate a trusted and more experienced point of view (yours).