Paging Kevin Shields-Can you explain this further?

[wdking]

"alot of underplaners have that lead arm riding high and too much force along the shaft. Clubface is completely blocked by lead arm, butt end, shaft and hosel."
Sorry to revive some older stuff. Can we see an illustration and any other juicy tidbits.
How's the Underplane video coming?

 

[rogerdodger]

Not Kevin, but I think I know what he is referring to. If you swing too much in to out, your left arm arches, making it tough to square the clubface. I have had instructors tell me I am leading too much with my left arm. I know now from this site, that your left arm cannot block the clubface if you are swinging on on plane. It makes it easy to swing left.

 

[wdking]

Not Kevin, but I think I know what he is referring to. If you swing too much in to out, your left arm arches, making it tough to square the clubface. I have had instructors tell me I am leading too much with my left arm. I know now from this site, that your left arm cannot block the clubface if you are swinging on on plane. It makes it easy to swing left.

Can you elaborate on the left arm arch and how you keep it from blocking the clubface? Strange as it sounds, on video I have beaten the below plane issues leading to impact, but through impact and follow through my swing looks the same as it did during the below plane days and not enough left. So maybe I'm still missing a component.

The best part of this forum is you wouldn't hear or discuss this stuff anywhere else.

 

[rogerdodger]

I can only tell you what has helped with me, not a teacher, devoted to this site. When I swing too inside out, which is my tendency, In order to keep from flipping, my left wrist and arm get higher, causing a thin shot to right. If I swiveled, I hit a huge hook. It is a plane issue. I need a tumble, so that I do not get underplane. Then I can swivel and hit the ball with a slight draw. Taking my right thumb off has helped, so has NHA and to an extent NSA 2. In my swing, when I come in too far under or in to out, clubface opens too much. Twistaway helps a lot. Bottom line, I need to start down to the ball on plane for the club path to go left enough and not too far out to right field. I have a strong left arm, I pull a lot from the top, swing to right and left wrist essentially blocks the club from releasing. At impact I try to get the shaft up the left arm. It feels like flipping, but without the right thumb on the shaft, as long as my right shoulder drives, I hit the ball great. I cannot drive the right shoulder when I swing too in to out. Watch Kenny Perry, that is how I try to keep from swinging too in to out.

 

[Jwat]

I can only tell you what has helped with me, not a teacher, devoted to this site. When I swing too inside out, which is my tendency, In order to keep from flipping, my left wrist and arm get higher, causing a thin shot to right. If I swiveled, I hit a huge hook. It is a plane issue. I need a tumble, so that I do not get underplane. Then I can swivel and hit the ball with a slight draw. Taking my right thumb off has helped, so has NHA and to an extent NSA 2. In my swing, when I come in too far under or in to out, clubface opens too much. Twistaway helps a lot. Bottom line, I need to start down to the ball on plane for the club path to go left enough and not too far out to right field. I have a strong left arm, I pull a lot from the top, swing to right and left wrist essentially blocks the club from releasing. At impact I try to get the shaft up the left arm. It feels like flipping, but without the right thumb on the shaft, as long as my right shoulder drives, I hit the ball great. I cannot drive the right shoulder when I swing too in to out. Watch Kenny Perry, that is how I try to keep from swinging too in to out.

Thanks for the input. Same issues I have been dealing with. Going to try and get the thumb off the club for a few days. In another thread Jim was talking about on the downswing instead of focusing on your right shoulder, think of your left going up and OUT. This has really helped me too! Although still thinning the irons.

 

[birdie_man]

I think what Kevin may have described is the opposite of Brian's "tumble."

Still not sure why it's called tumble but I think I like it.

 

[vjsinger]

Thanks for the input. Same issues I have been dealing with. Going to try and get the thumb off the club for a few days. In another thread Jim was talking about on the downswing instead of focusing on your right shoulder, think of your left going up and OUT. This has really helped me too! Although still thinning the irons.

You're probably thinning it because you don't get your tailbone ahead of the neck bone early enough before you move the left shoulder up and around.

 

[Kevin Shields]

I dont know how I missed this thread but I'll post on it tonight.

 

[Teris10]

I dont know how I missed this thread but I'll post on it tonight.

Must be the cryptic thread title.

 

[Jwat]

You're probably thinning it because you don't get your tailbone ahead of the neck bone early enough before you move the left shoulder up and around.

So are you saying maybe a little more hip pop. VJ, I think you and I struggle from alot of the same issues. Your swing is definitley better than mine though. Your input is always valuable. If I can ever just hit my irons a little more consistant I will be around scratch.

I am definitley getting a lesson from Brian again soon and hopefully participate when all the instructors get together again.

 

[Jwat]

As you know, baseball is much more rotary in nature than golf is and what I think most good baseball players need to feel is a slower start to transition without losing the stretch or pull in the left side, leave the arms at the top while going left with correct sequence. A more lateral move with the body, in correct sequence, while keeping that stretch.

When I attempt this move at the ball I do an extreme left hip pop and my hands and shoulders collapse as one piece down towards my back foot. Really ugly, hit behind the ball with a driver 2 inches and thin it with my irons.

 

[vjsinger]

When I attempt this move at the ball I do an extreme left hip pop and my hands and shoulders collapse as one piece down towards my back foot. Really ugly, hit behind the ball with a driver 2 inches and thin it with my irons.

Sounds like it may be too violent of a move. Brian's cart pushing analogy is good help. The golf swing feels to me much slower and deliberate than the baseball swing pivot. The hands and shoulders should not collapse or even feel like they have a chance to. Remember the kinetic sequence. Hips,shoulders,arms,hands,club...impact.

 

[jbrunk]

I dont know how I missed this thread but I'll post on it tonight.

I hate to be a nag, but not that much.

 

[Kevin Shields]

"alot of underplaners have that lead arm riding high and too much force along the shaft. Clubface is completely blocked by lead arm, butt end, shaft and hosel."
Sorry to revive some older stuff. Can we see an illustration and any other juicy tidbits.
How's the Underplane video coming?

Video is non-existent. What do want more details on? Lets revive this a little. Sorry i keep missing it.

 

[wdking]

Video is non-existent. What do want more details on? Lets revive this a little. Sorry i keep missing it.

Just some more details. I must be stupid or something but I can't get this in my head. It sounds like me. MJ said I walk the club down the fairway, instead of going left, and this might be a little clue as to why.

Thanks

 

[Kevin Shields]

There's no doubt. Once you find out where your hands really should be at impact, someone like yourself sees how high the left side runs out and how it blocks the club from going left.

 

[wdking]

There's no doubt. Once you find out where your hands really should be at impact, someone like yourself sees how high the left side runs out and how it blocks the club from going left.

Can you draw me a "map"? I know what is supposed to happen, but I'm struggling with why it isn't happening. Maybe you can dumb down your quote in the first thread so an idiot such as me could apply it.

Thanks,
Wayne

 

[alexlimco]

Can you draw me a "map"? I know what is supposed to happen, but I'm struggling with why it isn't happening. Maybe you can dumb down your quote in the first thread so an idiot such as me could apply it.

Thanks,
Wayne

I am an idiot too. Found that to swing a lot more left, I have to really AIM a lot more left and then swing the h*ll over to the left. Just do what you feel is right and let the ball flight confirm the results.

Cheers.

 

[Kevin Shields]

Am I being accused of something here? Its not like I'm f***ing Mandrin speaking in tongues. Post up a swing so we can have a look to see some possibilities as to why the club is stuck under. I think I'm the idiot cuz if i were a little brighter I could post a video of my own. Please elaborate on what you dont understand so I can try to help better.

 

[wdking]

Am I being accused of something here? Its not like I'm f***ing Mandrin speaking in tongues. Post up a swing so we can have a look to see some possibilities as to why the club is stuck under. I think I'm the idiot cuz if i were a little brighter I could post a video of my own. Please elaborate on what you dont understand so I can try to help better.

Kevin,
I have nothing but the utmost respect for you. Your quote that I reproduced was from an interesting thread that died. You spoke of sticking the handle in your right leg, hitting driver off the knees etc, where you gave the hint as soft draw. Now, I seemed to have beaten the underplane downswing, but impact and follow through are still as if I'm underplane, walking the club down the fairway. Don't get me wrong, I understand the golf swing, and I can scrape it around pretty good (5.4 index) for a weekend only golfer.
The questions:
1) The lead arm, in the downswing, is too high-Where is it? In relation to what? And the cure/prevention of this.
2) The clubface is blocked by the lead arm, butt, shaft and my personal favorite the hosel-Again where is it doing this? And how to fix/just do it right?
This drives me nuts, because I have been trying for two years to swing more left, and I must be a moron because I just don't get it.

Thanks, and remember I respect your opinion as much as anyone's.