From behind the target line, how close should my hand path match on backswing and downswing. In my swing, my hands go inside then up forcing my hands on the downswing to come over the top and a good 6 inches closer to the target line on the downswing. Most good players hand path matches very close.I am a 3 handicapper, hit slight draw, but suffer from some ball striking inconsistency. Am i correct in working them to matchup?
path of hands
- Thread starter mtwie
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mtwie
The hand path doesn't match mate....
When two connected forces are travelling in the same direction they have a tendency to try and join together and form a straight line..
The line in question here is the line from your left shoulder to the center of the clubface.
At address your arm line and your clubshaft line are both under the above line, albeit at different angles due to the set of the wrist.
At impact the two lines straighten themselves out somewhat to conform with the shoulder clubhead line (weight of the swinging clubhead makes your left wrist goes into ulna deviation).
Therefore at impact your hands will be slightly higher than they were at address. If your hands were in the same position they were at address, you would hit a mega fat shot...
The hand path doesn't match mate....
When two connected forces are travelling in the same direction they have a tendency to try and join together and form a straight line..
The line in question here is the line from your left shoulder to the center of the clubface.
At address your arm line and your clubshaft line are both under the above line, albeit at different angles due to the set of the wrist.
At impact the two lines straighten themselves out somewhat to conform with the shoulder clubhead line (weight of the swinging clubhead makes your left wrist goes into ulna deviation).
Therefore at impact your hands will be slightly higher than they were at address. If your hands were in the same position they were at address, you would hit a mega fat shot...
....
Yes I knew what you meant..
On the backswing and most of the downswing they match most of the time, following an arc that is slightly flatter than the clubhead arc, but definitely not just before and at impact, where the hands are higher than at address, thus lifting above the original plane/arc...
Yes I knew what you meant..
On the backswing and most of the downswing they match most of the time, following an arc that is slightly flatter than the clubhead arc, but definitely not just before and at impact, where the hands are higher than at address, thus lifting above the original plane/arc...
Most people don't set up the same way that they will be during impact. Most people setup to the ball with their hands equal with the ball or sometimes behind it.
Now what puttmad says is true.. but so is what mtwie says. The better the player, the closer thier hands tend to travel along the same plane. However at impact it's different than at setup by usually no more than a couple of inches. This is due to a miriad of reasons but primarily because #1 the swingers weight has shifted forward.. #2 the hands have traveled further along their path at impact than they are at setup position.. and #3 most people do not set up with their hands on the correct plane.
Ideally, when the setup is correct, the hands will swing on the same PLANE that they were at setup. But since the swing center moves back during the backswing, and forward during the forward swing they will rarely ever occupy the same space.
But this is all using my own theories and I'm sure others will have a different opinion on this matter.
Now what puttmad says is true.. but so is what mtwie says. The better the player, the closer thier hands tend to travel along the same plane. However at impact it's different than at setup by usually no more than a couple of inches. This is due to a miriad of reasons but primarily because #1 the swingers weight has shifted forward.. #2 the hands have traveled further along their path at impact than they are at setup position.. and #3 most people do not set up with their hands on the correct plane.
Ideally, when the setup is correct, the hands will swing on the same PLANE that they were at setup. But since the swing center moves back during the backswing, and forward during the forward swing they will rarely ever occupy the same space.
But this is all using my own theories and I'm sure others will have a different opinion on this matter.
Mr Inconsistent
Banned
I know a lot of old school golfers like Snead, Bobby Jones, Byron Nelson, Nicklaus, basically all of them, took the hands inside and then arced them upward to the top (like you do), then coming down it was linear. What I gather from that is that the path of the hands on the backswing doesn't really mean el squat. You can bring it back like Raymond Floyd after a case of beer as long as you get to a good postion at the top and go from there.
My references above were basically re the hand position at/just before impact.
I have the GASP system on my computer and i have studied all "the best" frame by frame, after marking their hand positions (height from the ground) at address.
At impact (from behind the line) their hands are definitely higher, as they must be because the shoulder to clubhead length is longer at impact than address..
This is easy to prove. Simply address the ball and then lift your left shoulder so the clubshaft/arm angle straightens out, as it would at the bottom of the swing. As you lift the shoulder the left wrist will go into ulna deviation and the hands will raise...in effect the hands are way under the plane at address and "on plane" at impact..therefore the hands cannot describe the same arc on the downswing as they do on the backswing, which brings us right back to where this thread started...
I have the GASP system on my computer and i have studied all "the best" frame by frame, after marking their hand positions (height from the ground) at address.
At impact (from behind the line) their hands are definitely higher, as they must be because the shoulder to clubhead length is longer at impact than address..
This is easy to prove. Simply address the ball and then lift your left shoulder so the clubshaft/arm angle straightens out, as it would at the bottom of the swing. As you lift the shoulder the left wrist will go into ulna deviation and the hands will raise...in effect the hands are way under the plane at address and "on plane" at impact..therefore the hands cannot describe the same arc on the downswing as they do on the backswing, which brings us right back to where this thread started...
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I agree that rerouting the hands can be done... just as rerouting the club. In fact the one effects the other.
My motion (back then) was linear toward the ball with the club but I was too high. If you look in the frame by frame you can clearly see my hands move over the top and I shut the face of the club. This closed clubface and almost a "fake" trap move was the only way I could hit the ball squarely once my hands got so high.
I understand that it could be done, re routing the club. My question is would i be a more consistent ball striker if my backswing would be more up than behind which would make my hand path match up closer on backswing and downswing which is a characteristic of all good ball strikers i have checked.
mtwie,
There are so many variables that it would really be hard to say if you should persue this "one plane" type swing. How you grip the club, stand to the ball, pivot and how you percieve the power delivery.
There is a school of thought that one should play with the power first and the alignments will sort themselves out.
I've been working recently on loading my hands early in the backswing which causes my right forearm to bend earlier. This seems to prevent a 'too much behind' move. More up. Even though the feeling is up and down, the plane still shifts due to my choice of release and trigger types.
Jared Willerson
Super Moderator
I find trying to feel my forearms being pressed together on the backswing helps with coming to far inside and sets up an on plane right shoulder delivery on the down stroke.
I think focussing on hand arc may be a mistake.
The actual clubhead arc is the thing you are trying to control and by focussing or "feeeling" that, you hands should automatically end up in the right positions anywhere in the swing, without any concious thought/action.
I think you find most of the pros mention "being able to feel the position of the clubhead" during their swings, as a being priority..
In a golf swing you "swing the clubhead" and everything else must conform to that intent.
The actual clubhead arc is the thing you are trying to control and by focussing or "feeeling" that, you hands should automatically end up in the right positions anywhere in the swing, without any concious thought/action.
I think you find most of the pros mention "being able to feel the position of the clubhead" during their swings, as a being priority..
In a golf swing you "swing the clubhead" and everything else must conform to that intent.
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6-G-0 - All motion is focused on driving the Hands-NOT THE CLUB-toward the BALL.
cmartingolf
New
right forearm plane
Mtwie, in most cases, not all, the shaft will align with the right forearm at impact. Most players don't set up with the right forearm on plane at address. Thus your hands will be higher and closer to the ball at impact. From down the line, draw a line from the sweet spot through your right elbow. That's where the alignment you'll see at impact with most players. What are your misses??
Mtwie, in most cases, not all, the shaft will align with the right forearm at impact. Most players don't set up with the right forearm on plane at address. Thus your hands will be higher and closer to the ball at impact. From down the line, draw a line from the sweet spot through your right elbow. That's where the alignment you'll see at impact with most players. What are your misses??
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