Plane shift/bending vs. OTT....

[Bill Miracle]

Are these the same thing? Can they be different? If different, I would assume one or both are causing my pulls....so, how would I work on curing both????


Thanks!

 

[zarro]

Are these the same thing? Can they be different? If different, I would assume one or both are causing my pulls....so, how would I work on curing both????


Thanks!

Here's my understanding. OTT is a plane shift, but you can have a plane shift that causes you to hook/hit huge push draws also. Also remember that you might not be coming OTT necessarily, you might just be hitting the back of the ball with a closed clubface. I would try hitting balls out to right field, concentrating on hitting the inside aft of the ball. Another thing to do when your doing that is to try to hit the ball very high, which will work on axis tilt. If you do those things with a closed clubface at separation you should get a draw/hook.

 

[Brian Manzella]

"Over the top" vs. "Plane Shift"

...we are taking about palne shofts that still draw straight plane lines....ok?...

Plane Shift

The intentional or unintentional movement by the player from one plane angle toanother, without changing the plane line.


"Over the top"

The mostly unintentional shift from the top by a player that EVEN WITHOUT A PLANE ANGLE SHIFT will cause the plane line to "bend" far to the left of the desired plane line.

 

[Bill Miracle]

How about bending the plane line vs. ott..

So, OTT bends the plane line. Is there other ways I could be bending the plane line to the left without coming over the top?

 

[Bill Miracle]

Not sure this is what I want to do...

Here's my understanding. OTT is a plane shift, but you can have a plane shift that causes you to hook/hit huge push draws also. Also remember that you might not be coming OTT necessarily, you might just be hitting the back of the ball with a closed clubface. I would try hitting balls out to right field, concentrating on hitting the inside aft of the ball. Another thing to do when your doing that is to try to hit the ball very high, which will work on axis tilt. If you do those things with a closed clubface at separation you should get a draw/hook.

If I don't pull it....and don't consciously try to compensate for a pull....I hit nice, straight shots that have a teeny draw or fade...very little.

When I go trying to swing out to right field or add axis tilt (more of it), it get all kinds of shots that I wouldn't hit other wise (pushes, slices, hooks, etc..)

I do "think about" hitting just inside the back of the ball using Brian's 3:30-8:30 thought. Don't know that I really achieve this but the thought is there.

I think my "plane shift" term my be something I used the wrong terminology on. Maybe I should have used plane-bending. Either way...If I can figure out the cause of these pulls, my game will enormously improve.

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

If I don't pull it....and don't consciously try to compensate for a pull....I hit nice, straight shots that have a teeny draw or fade...very little.

When I go trying to swing out to right field or add axis tilt (more of it), it get all kinds of shots that I wouldn't hit other wise (pushes, slices, hooks, etc..)

I do "think about" hitting just inside the back of the ball using Brian's 3:30-8:30 thought. Don't know that I really achieve this but the thought is there.

I think my "plane shift" term my be something I used the wrong terminology on. Maybe I should have used plane-bending. Either way...If I can figure out the cause of these pulls, my game will enormously improve.

Bill, do you feel like you might be swaying off the ball to the right?

 

[Bill Miracle]

Yeah, it's possible...

I'll take a look at that tomorrow. How would that cause pulls?

 

[tourdeep]

Mr Miracle

Recently, I went thru a bout of pulls. Tried a bunch of tricks from the bag, but nothing was working.

I may have found an old habit was not exorcised. I used to have a push elbow with a different type of swing pattern. Today, it is a feeling of pitch elbow, or basically in front of the trail hip. When I identified the postion, the pulls silently disappeared.

To the instructors, can elbow position cause pulls?

 

[Bill Miracle]

Today, I worked on...

1. Spine angle...keeping the butt against the wall.
2. B/S pivot - keeping the left foot more planted, the knees from collasping
3. right shoulder down plane
4. holding wrist cock longer

Better results. Driver was sweet. Got a couple of pulls but...started hitting more draws and small hooks.

So Jim, I think the spine angle, pivot work proved I may have been swaying some going back. What does that tell you?

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

1. Spine angle...keeping the butt against the wall.
2. B/S pivot - keeping the left foot more planted, the knees from collasping
3. right shoulder down plane
4. holding wrist cock longer

Better results. Driver was sweet. Got a couple of pulls but...started hitting more draws and small hooks.

So Jim, I think the spine angle, pivot work proved I may have been swaying some going back. What does that tell you?

It is the reason for all the "weird results" you mentioned earlier when you work on "axis tilt" which is what i figured.

When you sway off the ball and try and tilt you get all kinds of bad stuff lol.

 

[Bill Miracle]

Thanks Jim,

I think my axis tilt has been good as I didn't need to adjust it after working on the things I mentioned.

Looks like my pivot and action into the ball was off.