Putting pivot point

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In a standard putting setup, lets take Tiger Woods for an example, where is the pivot point for the putter? What I am trying to figure out is what the arc shape would be if he swung the putter perfectly on plane and at the same degrees as what the putter is designed to sit. I am thinking of buying a putting arc but I don’t believe that one size fits all, so I was going to calculate the exact arc that I would need. Here’s a chance for you smart people to show off a bit, thanks, Matt.
 
Matt,

I believe the formulae are printed on the product along with diagrams indicating how they are to be implemented.
Tom
 
Ok, I decided to measure the distance from the sweetspot of the putter and the point between my shoulders to find out what the arc of my putter should be. I came up with 53.5", instead of doing complicated math I just took a piece of string and tied a knot in both ends at 53.5" then stuck two tees in the knots and held one end still on the carpet and drew an arc with the other on the carpet. I figured before I drop $90 on a putting arc I would see if I liked putting that way by using the marks in the carpet as a visual aid. What I instantly discovered was I was already swinging on an arc but I was manipulating the blade so it was staying straight to the putting line instead of letting it be square to the arc. I started what felt like to me, opening the putter face up as I swung back and instantly started hitting good putts. I am basically now keeping the putter face square to the arc. I practice with lines on the ball and if I can make them roll straight I know it was a good putt. I will probably just keep using the string to make an arc just for a visual, I will have to try it on a green to see if I can raise the grass just enough to see the arc without doing any damage.
 

dbl

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If I understand the string and the two tees, you used them like a large compass, to draw part of a circle on the ground, right? Wouldn't that make a much more curved arc than a circle on a tilted plane? Based on the light green area on that ellipse page, seems like the radius of a circle on the ground should be about 18'.
 
MattF, interesting question.

just want to throw in 2 cents on your experiment, that be careful whether your approximation is even close to the reality. what i mean is that the distance from the putter to somewhere between your shoulders is one thing, how you really use your body to putt may be another. i can think of some factors that may confound the situation: your forward posture from the hip, the angle your hold your putter relative to the ground, etc. in other words your "true" arc may be tough to estimate.

to go further, as you have pointed out, your true arc may or may not fit in the arc block that everyone uses.
 
I was thinking that a tilted plane would give a less curved arc also but not sure how that really works. The club travels on a circle but the path that it takes is up and in on the backswing and the forward swing and it only comes into contact with the ground at the bottom of the circle. Since the line is only a visual aid would it from the perspective of my eyes at the fixed point they are at be representive of the actual path? Should of paid more attention in geometry class.
 

westy

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who cares.

Forget about your arc. You can almost let it do as it pleases.
The ball goes where the face points..... mostly......
Concern yourself with ''''relative rotation'''' of the face - to the arc.
Tiger 'swings'..... pretty straight ....but twists his face.... while he is doing it.....
Loren Roberts is very square to his path, which incidentally quite curvy.....
Which way do you swing......hmmmm....lol
Let your path do as it pleases, it only accounts for 20% or direction...
Learn what your face does, and sync it up..... balance it up (the relative rotation) so it repeats.....
The best putters repeat.
No stroke is optimal.
 
I agree that the path is not nearly as important as the face but I am trying to get more consistent with my putting and the closer I can get to having a natural arc I think the better off I will be. Right now I am making nothing outside 6 ft., so I go to a golf course knowing that I can do no better than a 72 if I hit the ball perfectly add in 4 missed greens and a couple of wayward shots and your looking at an 80. I need to do something different. The most frustrating thing is not knowing what is really going on in the putting swing. I didn't even know I was closing the face to the arc until yesterday, I thought I was just pulling my putts on the forward swing. I think just having the visual arc, albeit probably not the correct arc, was a benefit to see what the face was doing on the swing. Anybody know of a SAM putt lab in the Michigan area?
 
putting is indeed confusing at its best:)

concur with westy that if there is one thing to focus on for now, it is the putter face at impact. we have the arc, then we also now have the inside down the line arc,,,really confusing to me.

yet, one thing we can all work on is not to swing "all over the place", meaning, we would do inside out on one swing, then outside in on another and don't even know our stats or tendencies. as i said in the other thread about the samlab, it clearly helped diagnose my kid's tendencies. what to do about it of course is another story, but it is a good start. (by the way, just so i am clear about it, the lab does not help with break reading or distance control. to me those 2 items are very important)

in her case, we feel that she can benefit from having her elbows more tucked in toward the body, more connected to the body, so that the downswing preferably comes from the spine, not from the shoulder joints, and certainly not from the wrists. if at the impact the wrists sneak out and "help out" just a little (another beautiful human trait), it is not easy to tell. and certainly not an easy habit to break.

short of going to a formal putting lab, consider the following set up.

get a large piece of paper (even newspaper). draw a straight line across the length of it. attach some sort of a marker or pen to the bottom of the putter head so that as you swing the putter, the pen can leave a mark or line on the paper.

set up and address on the paper and line up the putter aiming over the line to putt down that line. perhaps close your eyes and try putt the way you usually putt. after couple strokes check on the paper your art piece, your natural arc:)

could be telling,,,:)
 
Matt - I think in his book Stan Utley says that you can make a very functional (and almost infinitely adjustable) putting arc with a flexible aluminium yardstick and 3 tees in the ground to hold it in shape.
 
Tracing

Quite a bit of research at SAM by Dr. Christian Marquardt suggests that any "training device" that promotes "tracing" can lead to specific problems ie. tension, and have adverse affects on your ability to make putts. Very similar to "writer's cramp". Find a stroke that has the proper amount of up and down and match the around aspects of the stroke and you will be successful.
Good luck,
MK
 
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