Real Live Lesson "Doctor Reports"....

[Brian Manzella]

October 21, 2009

Golfer was a male, late 40's early 50's, former pro football player, former 2 handicapper.

On his first shot, which I watched from the DTL view.

His hips were very open, his shoulders did not turn very much, his club was extra open at the top, and his was well above the plane coming into the ball.

I asked him if his normal shot was a fade. He said it was a draw, but lately was a pull draw.

From the front view, I could see his hips were very open and tilted to the target severely. His upper body was very forward to his hips, and his hands were quite forward. Divots were very left, and the student noted that this was more than normal.

Over the next few minutes, I squared up and de-tilted his hips, and moved his upper body and hands less forward.

This allowed him to approach the inside of the ball, coming down on plane.

We had to adjust his ball position back for his shorter clubs and forward for the driver.

We also widened and closed his driver stance.

Happy golfer, better shots, more distance, proper trajectory with his driver.

 

[jimmyt]

WoW

Never heard you mention a pattern once, that's odd!!!!! Isn't it?

 

[vjsinger]

Can you show us some before and after video, please?

 

[mgranato]

That's all fine and dandy, but the real question - was he flat or upright?

Love this kinda stuff. Someone getting fixed without buying into anything or deciding which color pill to take.

 

[duckslice]

October 21, 2009

Golfer was a male, late 40's early 50's, former pro football player, former 2 handicapper.

On his first shot, which I watched from the DTL view.

His hips were very open, his shoulders did not turn very much, his club was extra open at the top, and his was well above the plane coming into the ball.

I asked him if his normal shot was a fade. He said it was a draw, but lately was a pull draw.

From the front view, I could see his hips were very open and tilted to the target severely. His upper body was very forward to his hips, and his hands were quite forward. Divots were very left, and the student noted that this was more than normal.

Over the next few minutes, I squared up and de-tilted his hips, and moved his upper body and hands less forward.

This allowed him to approach the inside of the ball, coming down on plane.

We had to adjust his ball position back for his shorter clubs and forward for the driver.

We also widened and closed his driver stance.

Happy golfer, better shots, more distance, proper trajectory with his driver.

Fantastic description! I think I can picture the swing. I know all lessons are customized for each student but, if I’m interpreting this image correctly, I see this body motion frequently. The term I’ve used to describe it is an HRH. (high right hip – assuming he plays right handed) If you have time, please share how you got his hips de-tilted. Did you give him a specific drill to level them out? If yes did the drill require him to make a swing while he did it or was it a pivot only drill? If no just you just tell him to keep his hips more level?
Sounds like this guy is a good athlete and can get the club on the ball from wherever you put him. But, when you moved his upper half and hands less forward did he get below plane and hit any fat shots? If yes, did you provide any feedback on how the spine tilt change may have changed his low point? Did you feel any need to address his clubface issues?
Thanks Brain!

 

[Brian Manzella]

...how you got his hips de-tilted. Did you give him a specific drill to level them out?

Nope.

I just grabbed hold of them, and moved them where I wanted to be.

I do use a very specific technique for centering the hips tot the upper torso, and I'll have to post up and video of me doing it.

I moved them for every ball except about 5 of the first 40, and then every one of them until the last 10.

...when you moved his upper half and hands less forward did he get below plane and hit any fat shots?

Not so much "below plane" just too far inside-out. We moved the ball position back and that was that.

...did you provide any feedback on how the spine tilt change may have changed his low point?

I always explain what was going on to make him have the problems he was having—IF and only IF I think telling them would help.

Did you feel any need to address his clubface issues?

Not this time.

He only lost a couple of shots SLIGHTLY to the right.

I told him, "You probably adjusted the clubface open to get the ball to cut at the target before the hip fix, you know how to square it up..."

 

[Brian Manzella]

Never heard you mention a pattern once, that's odd!!!!! Isn't it?

He had a pattern already.

The guy has shot in the 60's before.

Can you show us some before and after video, please?

I didn't take any.

That's all fine and dandy, but the real question - was he flat or upright?

Slightly on the upright side of orthodox.

Someone getting fixed without buying into anything or deciding which color pill to take.

He didn't need an overhaul, and I don't have a pattern to sell.

 

[jimmyt]

Damn Internet!!!

Brian,

I was being sarcastic in light of many of the threads over the last week or so.

Also not speaking for "granato", but I think he was too.

Sorry

 

[birdie_man]

The thing is, you and Mr. granato are both terrible people.

 

[mgranato]

Ouch, Birdie_man.

For the record, Jimmyt spoke well for me. My comment was a complement on Brian's ability to fix folks without them having to "join" a mindset. No rebuilds when they aren't needed, no line drawing sessions, no nothing that isn't needed - just fix, and next.

Very refreshing!

 

[TROYNYGOLFER]

Originally Posted by vjsinger
Can you show us some before and after video, please?

I didn't take any.

Brian, I am curious as to why you do not video students on a routine basis? I have found video of lessons to be extremely helpful as I practice on what I have learned, by comparing my swing at the lesson to that on the practice range.

 

[birdie_man]

Ouch, Birdie_man.

For the record, Jimmyt spoke well for me. My comment was a complement on Brian's ability to fix folks without them having to "join" a mindset. No rebuilds when they aren't needed, no line drawing sessions, no nothing that isn't needed - just fix, and next.

Very refreshing!

Hehe. I was just joking of course. (just making sure!) I was trying to be somewhat ambiguous and left it open for you guys to call me on it.

I apologize for any corniness!

I am with you on Brian's approach BTW. (no doot aboot it)

 

[mgranato]

Just bein a hoser, eh?

If you can't needle golf buds then who can you needle?

 

[dbl]

Brian, I am curious as to why you do not video students on a routine basis? I have found video of lessons to be extremely helpful as I practice on what I have learned, by comparing my swing at the lesson to that on the practice range.

He's put up 3-4 "before and afters" in the last year, and that's pretty good. The dude is busy. Plus, you have to have the right situation to show something meaningful or even just to be able to have captured something. I can also say another thing - when I was with him, he gave videos to me (the student) so he doesn't have them himself. Now with some of the newer cameras maybe the issue is similar - deleting to gain space. But one basic thing is probably just not taking 'before' shots that often.

 

[TROYNYGOLFER]

He's put up 3-4 "before and afters" in the last year, and that's pretty good. The dude is busy. Plus, you have to have the right situation to show something meaningful or even just to be able to have captured something. I can also say another thing - when I was with him, he gave videos to me (the student) so he doesn't have them himself. Now with some of the newer cameras maybe the issue is similar - deleting to gain space. But one basic thing is probably just not taking 'before' shots that often.

Dbl, I was not necessarily asking for him to post the videos, just wondering if it was a routine part of the lesson. I simply find it invaluable to have video of my good swings as a refernce for when things go all to hell, as they inevitably do. You answered my question.