Shut Face Fader?
- Thread starter Wallop
- Start date
- Status
2 things.
1) Path could still be more left than the face.
or
2) What they mean is that at the top he has a shut face and plays a fade. I'm sure others can explain this better, but I feel that generally a person with a closed face at the top will have a slower rate of rotation through the ball (hold on) and play a cut. Just like sometimes a player with an open face at the top has a tremendous amount of forearm rotation resulting in a draw. I played all my junior and college golf as a "closed face cutter". Then I learned how to "swing".
1) Path could still be more left than the face.
or
2) What they mean is that at the top he has a shut face and plays a fade. I'm sure others can explain this better, but I feel that generally a person with a closed face at the top will have a slower rate of rotation through the ball (hold on) and play a cut. Just like sometimes a player with an open face at the top has a tremendous amount of forearm rotation resulting in a draw. I played all my junior and college golf as a "closed face cutter". Then I learned how to "swing".
thefuture37
Banned
its just referring to shut at the top. they aren't shut at impact.
Brian Manzella
Administrator
No such thing.
Why?
Nobody's clubface is closed at the top.
Why?
Nobody's clubface is closed at the top.
thefuture37
Banned
hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh fine. "less open" at the top than "orthodox". semantics.
Brian Manzella
Administrator
Guitar Hero
New member
Brian could you please explain why this is ?
tongzilla
New
square clubface would like something like this at the top: /
closed would like something like this | (toe up
)90 degrees open, "orthodox", would look like this: \
more open than "orthodox" would look like this: | (toe down)
Guitar Hero
New member
square clubface would like something like this at the top: /
closed would like something like this | (toe up
90 degrees open, "orthodox", would look like this: \
more open than "orthodox" would look like this: | (toe down)
That referance is related to a plane line.
When looking at the club face position in relation to the club path it can be open, square or closed to the club path at the top of the swing as well as any point in the swing.
tongzilla
New
Yes, if laid-off that would equate to more openness.
So these guys go from closed at the top to open through impact? In Trevino's book he says that he extends his left arm down the target line - even letting it come away from his body after impact. I'm still trying to figure out how he hit that big fade going down the target line with that arched wrist.
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
The arched wrist makes the club come in later and he doesnt continue to close it and swings left of the face
thefuture37
Banned
with the fade all you do is hold on through impact and turn your body. much easier to do under pressure than tossing javelins and such.
Notorious B.E.N.
New
This is why in soft draw you need a slight cup in your left wrist at the top. Correct?
Geoff Ogilvy had no problem "tossing javelins" today...
thefuture37
Banned
trevino had no trouble not tossing javelins on his way to 6 majors...whats your point?
Shut Faced Faders
Hmm...
Lee Trevino came to mind immediately
How about Jesper Parnevick? Byron Nelson?
All played with "relatively" shut faced actions. All very very good iron and wedge players.
The entire "square at the top" idea is crazy in my opinion. It's like trying to evaluate the total performance of a car from the size of its hubcaps. There are so many other more important variables to consider.
In my mind, a club is square at the starting position when its leading edge is perpendicular to the tangential line of the desired swing plane. What it looks like at the top however is so variable based on swing plane transitions, grip, clubface rotation, hinge action, etc that defining square at the top is for all purposes really crazy imho.
The definition used by golf channel broadcasters of "laying the blade" on the plane of the swing is bogus, especially if a plane parallel to the shaft plane at address is used. That would mean a clubface rotated 90 degrees clockwise around its shaft axis during the backswing.
Another question... when you view "square at the top" are you always viewing the same "top of the swing"? In other words, from the dtl perspective, is the club both parallel to the ground and perpendicular to the viewing plane?
See how difficult this "top of the swing clubface position" discussion can get?
Hmm...
Lee Trevino came to mind immediately
How about Jesper Parnevick? Byron Nelson?
All played with "relatively" shut faced actions. All very very good iron and wedge players.
The entire "square at the top" idea is crazy in my opinion. It's like trying to evaluate the total performance of a car from the size of its hubcaps. There are so many other more important variables to consider.
In my mind, a club is square at the starting position when its leading edge is perpendicular to the tangential line of the desired swing plane. What it looks like at the top however is so variable based on swing plane transitions, grip, clubface rotation, hinge action, etc that defining square at the top is for all purposes really crazy imho.
The definition used by golf channel broadcasters of "laying the blade" on the plane of the swing is bogus, especially if a plane parallel to the shaft plane at address is used. That would mean a clubface rotated 90 degrees clockwise around its shaft axis during the backswing.
Another question... when you view "square at the top" are you always viewing the same "top of the swing"? In other words, from the dtl perspective, is the club both parallel to the ground and perpendicular to the viewing plane?
See how difficult this "top of the swing clubface position" discussion can get?
Trevino is more of a "hold on and rotate" type swing by your definition. Ogilvy has much more of a "toss" release. That's my point, that both are effective.
thefuture37
Banned
read the whole thread. the question was about why people find it easier to hit fades under pressure. for most, its easier to hold on rather than toss under pressure.
Fair enough. I read the thread. It's actually about "shut face faders." Either way, you're entitled to your opinion. I still think that shot selection under pressure all depends on your own tendencies, misses, etc.
- Status