Unhappy with lesson from ex-Tour pro

[priceunderpar]

I was hitting the ball really well going into my first lesson with a new instructor today. The instructor played on the PGA and Sr Pga tour for awhile so I figured he must know what he's talking about. I wanted some tweeking to help me tighten up my swing.

He started by having me hit about a dozen balls so he could get a feel for me and evaluate my abilty. Afterward he told me how great my swing looked, how impressive my clubhead speed was and how much potential I had. He said he saw some flaws in my set-up which could easily be fixed and he was going to focus on 1-2 things with me.....

Then he proceeded to change everything

Set Up
1.He moved my hand placement from basically middle of my stance to my left thigh. The impact fix position
2.He moved my left foot back 2 inches to open my stance and had me open my hips
3.He had me pull my elbows into my body instead of having them hang straight
4.He had me change my take away by instructing me to cock my right wrist straight up ala Ryan Moore with the wrist problem (without the pause). So instead of starting the club straight back it moves up to my head and around.
5.He told me the swing is a left arm swing and not to assist at all with my right hand or arm and to get my right hand more under the left at the top of the back swing.
6. Every swing was too fast.
7.He didn't want me to pivot t the target and told me to turn left or spin left
8. He told me to keep my elbows tight to my body and not extend in the follow through.

I started the lesson by hitting a dozen balls all within 30 ft of my target about 135 out with a 9 iron. By the end of the lesson I was slapping it all over- pull shot, push shot, topped, shanked, fat shot, thin shot, hook, slice. $45 and an hour wasted to go from a 10 handicap swing to a 30 handicap swing.

I have taken 3 lessons in my life and have been terribly dissapointed by all of them. I am so frustrated.

 

[thefuture37]

you shoudve known what you were getting based on how much you paid. btw if you were hitting it so great before, why even take a lesson from someone you know nothing about?

 

[Bill Miracle]

Well, here is my opinion...for what it's worth...

any time someone changes your swing.....you may struggle BIG TIME with the changes.

I think it comes down to confidence that your pro knows what he is changing on you...your belief in what is being changed.

I took a series of lessons from Brian. Though I struggled after each series of lessons, after time, I began to play much much better. I can honestly say that the $ I've invested with this PGA/TGM pro has been much better spent than the $ I've spent elsewhere.

So, the changes made MAY not produce results tomorrow. But, if you coach knows what the hell he is doing, he will get you where you need to be. You may go backwards for awhile but, you should ultimately go forward.

I went forward very quickly after my lessons with Brian but, since I can't see Brian every week or every month, I eventually fell into some new problems...and went through new struggles In between seeing him personally, I got a lot of help from this site...what a bonus!!!!

I'm now down to a 20 after playing golf for less than 3 years. I mostly play from blue tees but occasionally play from the tips. I am now hitting my driver much more consistent (thank you Brian...airplane landing is sinking in) and about 30-40 yds longer than about 1 1/2 years ago (I am about 270-280 with much more consistency). My short game is becoming my strength as is my putting. I just have to get my mid to long irons working better and I can see low 80's coming very soon. Not too bad for a guy that took up golf at age 47 and about 10 hours of lessons from the man over a period of about 1.5 years.

I spent the first 1.5 years spending $ on so-called PGA pros, sons of ex-pga tour winners and the education was nothing more than helping me know when I finally found a winner of a mentor.

So, stick with this pro your're with....expect some set backs in trying to get better...or, stick with the info, videos, and personal lessons you can get here. I can't evaluate the info you got in your lessons and the changes suggested. I can only validate the value of this site and the man that runs it.

I recently lost my job and fortunately...after 3 months...have a new one...but...I can't wait until I can get myself in a position to spend another weekend with da man!! Take that as hype if you wish but...most of us that have been associated with Brian for sometime (me not as long as others) know we are getting the cutting edge as far as golf instruction goes.

 

[priceunderpar]

I went to see the guy to tweak things not totally change things up. I said I was playing pretty well not great.... for me, but I'm not playing as well as I have played in the past (2 years ago I was a 6 handicap shotting in the 70's often with a personal low round of 72). I'm consistant low 80's currently but I can't remember the last time I've broken 80.

So I saw him because 1. I'm not satisfied with my game, 2. He's a former tour player, so he should know a hell of a lot more than me 3. At $45 for an hour I figured it was pretty reasonable compared to most other instructors in the area. If he turned out to be good, then I got a deal.

I just really wish there was a Brian Manzela in South Texas. Anyone know of a good instructor from Chorpus Christi to Houston, TX? I would be willing to make a 3-4 hour drive for a guy who really knows his stuff. Unfortunatly Brian is too far away for me.

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

The instructor played on the PGA and Sr Pga tour for awhile so I figured he must know what he's talking about.

That's what a lot of people think and that's why a lot of people end up being disappointed.

 

[d0n]

I just really wish there was a Brian Manzela in South Texas. Anyone know of a good instructor from Chorpus Christi to Houston, TX? I would be willing to make a 3-4 hour drive for a guy who really knows his stuff. Unfortunatly Brian is too far away for me.

I'm in Houston and have yet to find an instructor that brings me lasting giddiness! The guy I'm currently working with is good but I wouldn't drive across town, let alone across the state to see him. I've been to Houston's Matt Swanson School of Golf at Wildcat and I personally wouldn't recommend them; though I didn't use Matt Swanson himself. That was 6 months and a grand down the drain. There's a TGM lady in the North Houston area but I've never been to her or know of anyone who has been to her. Perhaps the Manzella tour stop will come to Houston one day????

 

[Robbohank]

I went to see the guy to tweak things not totally change things up. I said I was playing pretty well not great.... for me, but I'm not playing as well as I have played in the past (2 years ago I was a 6 handicap shotting in the 70's often with a personal low round of 72). I'm consistant low 80's currently but I can't remember the last time I've broken 80.

So I saw him because 1. I'm not satisfied with my game, 2. He's a former tour player, so he should know a hell of a lot more than me 3. At $45 for an hour I figured it was pretty reasonable compared to most other instructors in the area. If he turned out to be good, then I got a deal.

I just really wish there was a Brian Manzela in South Texas. Anyone know of a good instructor from Chorpus Christi to Houston, TX? I would be willing to make a 3-4 hour drive for a guy who really knows his stuff. Unfortunatly Brian is too far away for me.

Isn't Chuck Cook still teaching in Austin?

 

[EdStraker]

Isn't Chuck Cook still teaching in Austin?

Barton Creek in Austin

 

[priceunderpar]

I'm unfamiliar with Chuck Cook. Is he a TGM instructor?

 

[lookingtolearn]

I'm unfamiliar with Chuck Cook. Is he a TGM instructor?

He's the "highest ranked" one actually.

 

[joeparr]

Yes, and I beleive brian likes some of his work. In Brians latest video answers he mentions chuck with his right shoulder takeaway and r. shoulder down to the ball,I beleive. ...joe

 

[Kevin Shields]

After some of the lessons i took with Brian, i literally couldn't keep it on the planet. Never once did my trust in him waver (frustrating though), because of the solid BELIEF that i had that he had nailed down what my issues were. Thats the difference. Your trust in the changes. Sometimes it takes time. There have been e few lessons where i knew instantly that the fix wasn't for me.

 

[priceunderpar]

Why does everyone who has taken or who gives lesson say you will get worse before you get better? Why does everyone accept that excuse? I've played sports all my life and coached as well. I have NEVER had a situation where I was coached or where I coached someone else to get worse. I think maybe golf instructors over teach when they give a lesson. They try to change everything in a 1 hour session, Maybe that's the fault of students expectations. Maybe everyone wants to go from hack to scratch in 1 hour.

All I know is that prior to my last lesson my instructor said he would focus on 1-2 things and then preceeded to want to drastically change 6-10 things. That's been my past experience as well. I acknowledge that golf is damn difficult which makes it hard to learn and teach, but shouldn't we hold instructors as a whole to higher standards?

I bought Brians building blocks video and man I really got a lot out of it. I practiced the chip and pitch swings in my office in front of the computer. I changed my right hand grip slightly to the angle he recomended. I also added bend to my right arm. The part about the right arm extending after impact and about sequenced release was very good for me. I watched the video, and went to the course with my son. I hit half a bucket of balls to practice what he was teaching and instantly I was hitting the ball better. I played 11 holes with my son at 3 over-the last 2 holes from the tips at even par. It was by far the best ball striking round I can remember, and my first 9 holes breaking 40 in probably close to a year.

Now I've gone through the whole "Now I've got it!" Epiphanies before where I thought I'd finally figured out the golf swing only to come crashing back to earth after hacking the ball around in my next round. So...I'm tempering my excitement for now. I will say however that I believe Building Blocks is the best golf video I've EVER seen. I'm including confessions of a flipper, NSA, and all of Brians Manzella shows as well.

 

[Steve Khatib]

I think maybe golf instructors over teach when they give a lesson. They try to change everything in a 1 hour session, Maybe that's the fault of students expectations. Maybe everyone wants to go from hack to scratch in 1 hour.

Precisely said!
Other than the instructor being just plain bad and incompetent, the biggest problem is not so much to go backwards before you go forwards, as this is untrue. Rather the time frame allowed does not match the expectation. So many good teachers over teach hoping to please the student(this is doomed)/ the real issue can be that students are tight asses!

For crying out loud take an hour lesson a month from a quality instructor that you have interviewed and screened and fix 6 components correctly over 12 months one or two at a time. And DONT listen to anyone other than your instructor or Brian and Co. If this doesnt work, and you followed the rules: I will give you a years worth of lessons FREE.

So stop complaining and take responsability!

 

[thefuture37]

All I know is that prior to my last lesson my instructor said he would focus on 1-2 things and then preceeded to want to drastically change 6-10 things. That's been my past experience as well. I acknowledge that golf is damn difficult which makes it hard to learn and teach, but shouldn't we hold instructors as a whole to higher standards?

wouldn't you have felt you hadn't gotten a good value if you had spent an hour with the guy and all he had you change was you hand position at address and the amount of axis tilt or something? Its likely that only changing one or two things wouldn't produce noticeable differences in striking, so then why would the instructor think you would come back for another lesson?

 

[Brian Manzella]

After some of the lessons i took with Brian, i literally couldn't keep it on the planet. Never once did my trust in him waver (frustrating though), because of the solid BELIEF that i had that he had nailed down what my issues were. Thats the difference. Your trust in the changes. Sometimes it takes time. There have been e few lessons where i knew instantly that the fix wasn't for me.

Kev,

You might want to clarify that you can find the planet these days.

 

[priceunderpar]

Future37,

I told the guy I was hitting the ball well at the time and just wanted an educated set of eyes who could find some things I was or was not doing that was causing problems for me. He said he like to focus on 1-2 things with each student, then he showed up with dynamite and wanted to blow the whole thing up. I would have felt that I got my moneys worth if the guy would have recomended anything no matter how minute that improved my swing.

After watching Building Blocks I changed my right hand grip slightly and my right arm to more closely match the shaft plain. I practiced sequence release from the video and I instantly hit the ball better- 3 over for 11 holes, breaking 40 for 9 holes for the first time in more than 6 months. That was 2 set up changes and 1 swing sequence change that I focused on and I was giddy with the immediate difference it made in the quality of my play.

Four Barrells,

I've asked guys what their teaching philosophy is and I have gotten answers like-"I focus on rotation", or "I teach each student differently because no one swings alike." I told the guy what I wanted and he seemed to be on the same page. If your an instructor, I'll go see you and find out what you know. You might as well give me your philosophy now...

 

[Steve Khatib]

I believe its all in the mind, just visualise the shot and it will happen Only joking. Gee these pros are just spin doctors. I suppose they had to learn this spin to survive because they cant teach.

Okay I feel for your as you have been burnt. As I said where are you and lets find you an instructor or if possible BMan or Mike Jacobs are the best IMO.

 

[jeffy]

I pay my barber the equivalent of $120 an hour; if all the guy can charge is $45, that should tell you something.

 

[priceunderpar]

I looked up Chuck Cook but it was going to be $250 for an hour lesson. I could afford that for 1 or 2 lessons, but I can't justify the rate if I were to see him as often as say once a month. I want to find an instructor I can afford to go see once or twice a month, not once or twice a year.

I also want to find an instructor who can help me and my 9 year old son. I've been his instructor so far, but I only know enough to be dangerous. He's got a nice swing and breaks 50 for 9 holes (from the ladies tees) at our home course. He loves the game and I could see him playing in high school and college if he continues to improve, but I am worried that my lack of expertise will hold him back eventually.