Wanole's swing
- Thread starter Brian Manzella
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Pretty nice move. A touch more swivel and 'right field' and you can maintain your lag longer - would help with the slight pull problem and occasional blocks I'd guess you have, but I'm being picky.
That swing says "sizzle", love the lower body stability on the backswing, nice compression
That swing says "sizzle", love the lower body stability on the backswing, nice compression
What I see is a very slight over the top type move - essentially your right shoulder is a bit too high. This gets your hands moving too far left past impact IMO. This isn't a bad way to go (see Trevino), but when combined with too high a right shoulder you can get the pulls.
Personally, I like the 'hit the ball with the back of the left shoulder' image for this - it gets you turning back (which you do fairly well) and keeps you from coming out/over too soon. The other image that would help is the 'entire right forearm' feel - hit the ball with the entire right forearm - specifically focus on getting the right elbow to the inside back corner.
I pre-set my right elbow to engrain that feel. Hitting chip shots focused on the right elbow (one of Geiberger's keys).
Essentially, read Brian's "Don't Hit it at the Target" article again. When you swing more 'out to the right' the swivel and rotation tend to take care of themselves. If you push it too much, either you are too weak on the grip, ball position is off, or you have 'lost the twist'.
Don't overdo it though, you aren't very far off. Some range work hitting high sweeping hooks should get you on track.
Inside back corner.
Personally, I like the 'hit the ball with the back of the left shoulder' image for this - it gets you turning back (which you do fairly well) and keeps you from coming out/over too soon. The other image that would help is the 'entire right forearm' feel - hit the ball with the entire right forearm - specifically focus on getting the right elbow to the inside back corner.
I pre-set my right elbow to engrain that feel. Hitting chip shots focused on the right elbow (one of Geiberger's keys).
Essentially, read Brian's "Don't Hit it at the Target" article again. When you swing more 'out to the right' the swivel and rotation tend to take care of themselves. If you push it too much, either you are too weak on the grip, ball position is off, or you have 'lost the twist'.
Don't overdo it though, you aren't very far off. Some range work hitting high sweeping hooks should get you on track.
Inside back corner.
I hope Brian doesn't mind me doing an analysis... Its one of my favourite things.. 
Your have alot of swinging tendencies ... and your better than the average punter at the range for sure and there is alot of good things but I will concentrate on problems rather than qualities for the sake of usefulness.
At address you have failed to set the wedges and the right forearm is below plane. The right forearm should always be an angled extension of the clubshaft with that angle being the bend right wrist. In your address your right wrist is actually in a cocked state. Remember that the clubshaft is always resting on an inclined plane... as Homer Kelley analogy - a pitched roof (Glossary). Therefore the right forearm must also be on that inclined plane which is ideally the turned shoulder plane which means by the time you reach the top of the backstroke your right shoulder should also be on the plane.
If you are happy with swinging. I would like you to think of starting up using extensor action to your advantage to allow the turning of the left wrist (start-up swivel) instead of the angled position you achieve in the start-up.
Although its hard to see - A really important thing to note is the position of pp3 to sence the clubhead lag and tracing the plane line in a true 3d backstroke. This is the first fleshy nugget of the trigger finger. It is hard to sence the clubhead when you don't actually have it in a triggered position.
In zone 1 - You aren't really getting the flat shoulder turn in the backstroke per the ideal 10-13-A and is more towards 10-13-C. This is because IMO you aren't using a true hands controlled pivot utelising a real right forearm startup which started with you not having the onplane right forearm wedge formed to begin with. Ideally you want the right forearm pickup of the power package to drag your pivot via the dual agent (shoulders) which is why in chapter 12 homer lists the ideal hip action as delayed... Maximum pivot lag...
Regarding achieving this I would have thoughts of taking your stroke standing on two stepping stones with a 300ft drop below you... Balance 2nd essential... whilst concentrating on the right forearm pickup to drag your pivot... Look at brians stroke in his signature above....
I remember when Yoda did a stroke analysis of me on this site and he said something which really helped regarding the stationary head per the first essential in 2-0. Your head position should be established at impact fix and then remain as the word says stationary creating a more sound geometric low point to your stroke... remember your left shoulder being the fulcrum and the primary lever assembly forms the radius of your stroke. Think of your head always staying in the middle of your stance using the hula flexability of the hip action.
As you are a swinger you correctly finish the backstroke at the end as apposed to the top....
On the downstroke - You are attempting to use the sequenced release of the swinger 4-2-3 which you do, but because your head isn't in its correct location, you are forced to disrupt the clubhead orbit (geometry of the circle) and steer(the first snare) which means you are always teetering on the edge of having throwaway.
Hope this helps
Mathew
Your have alot of swinging tendencies ... and your better than the average punter at the range for sure
and there is alot of good things but I will concentrate on problems rather than qualities for the sake of usefulness.At address you have failed to set the wedges and the right forearm is below plane. The right forearm should always be an angled extension of the clubshaft with that angle being the bend right wrist. In your address your right wrist is actually in a cocked state. Remember that the clubshaft is always resting on an inclined plane... as Homer Kelley analogy - a pitched roof (Glossary). Therefore the right forearm must also be on that inclined plane which is ideally the turned shoulder plane which means by the time you reach the top of the backstroke your right shoulder should also be on the plane.
If you are happy with swinging. I would like you to think of starting up using extensor action to your advantage to allow the turning of the left wrist (start-up swivel) instead of the angled position you achieve in the start-up.
Although its hard to see - A really important thing to note is the position of pp3 to sence the clubhead lag and tracing the plane line in a true 3d backstroke. This is the first fleshy nugget of the trigger finger. It is hard to sence the clubhead when you don't actually have it in a triggered position.
In zone 1 - You aren't really getting the flat shoulder turn in the backstroke per the ideal 10-13-A and is more towards 10-13-C. This is because IMO you aren't using a true hands controlled pivot utelising a real right forearm startup which started with you not having the onplane right forearm wedge formed to begin with. Ideally you want the right forearm pickup of the power package to drag your pivot via the dual agent (shoulders) which is why in chapter 12 homer lists the ideal hip action as delayed... Maximum pivot lag...
Regarding achieving this I would have thoughts of taking your stroke standing on two stepping stones with a 300ft drop below you... Balance 2nd essential... whilst concentrating on the right forearm pickup to drag your pivot... Look at brians stroke in his signature above....
I remember when Yoda did a stroke analysis of me on this site and he said something which really helped regarding the stationary head per the first essential in 2-0. Your head position should be established at impact fix and then remain as the word says stationary creating a more sound geometric low point to your stroke... remember your left shoulder being the fulcrum and the primary lever assembly forms the radius of your stroke. Think of your head always staying in the middle of your stance using the hula flexability of the hip action.
As you are a swinger you correctly finish the backstroke at the end as apposed to the top....
On the downstroke - You are attempting to use the sequenced release of the swinger 4-2-3 which you do, but because your head isn't in its correct location, you are forced to disrupt the clubhead orbit (geometry of the circle) and steer(the first snare) which means you are always teetering on the edge of having throwaway.
Hope this helps
Mathew
quote:Originally posted by Mathew
I hope Brian doesn't mind me doing an analysis... Its one of my favourite things..
Your have alot of swinging tendencies ... and your better than the average punter at the range for sure
At address you have failed to set the wedges and the right forearm is below plane. The right forearm should always be an angled extension of the clubshaft with that angle being the bend right wrist. In your address your right wrist is actually in a cocked state. Remember that the clubshaft is always resting on an inclined plane... as Homer Kelley analogy - a pitched roof (Glossary). Therefore the right forearm must also be on that inclined plane which is ideally the turned shoulder plane which means by the time you reach the top of the backstroke your right shoulder should also be on the plane.
If you are happy with swinging. I would like you to think of starting up using extensor action to your advantage to allow the turning of the left wrist (start-up swivel) instead of the angled position you achieve in the start-up.
Although its hard to see - A really important thing to note is the position of pp3 to sence the clubhead lag and tracing the plane line in a true 3d backstroke. This is the first fleshy nugget of the trigger finger. It is hard to sence the clubhead when you don't actually have it in a triggered position.
In zone 1 - You aren't really getting the flat shoulder turn in the backstroke per the ideal 10-13-A and is more towards 10-13-C. This is because IMO you aren't using a true hands controlled pivot utelising a real right forearm startup which started with you not having the onplane right forearm wedge formed to begin with. Ideally you want the right forearm pickup of the power package to drag your pivot via the dual agent (shoulders) which is why in chapter 12 homer lists the ideal hip action as delayed... Maximum pivot lag...
Regarding achieving this I would have thoughts of taking your stroke standing on two stepping stones with a 300ft drop below you... Balance 2nd essential... whilst concentrating on the right forearm pickup to drag your pivot... Look at brians stroke in his signature above....
I remember when Yoda did a stroke analysis of me on this site and he said something which really helped regarding the stationary head per the first essential in 2-0. Your head position should be established at impact fix and then remain as the word says stationary creating a more sound geometric low point to your stroke... remember your left shoulder being the fulcrum and the primary lever assembly forms the radius of your stroke. Think of your head always staying in the middle of your stance using the hula flexability of the hip action.
As you are a swinger you correctly finish the backstroke at the end as apposed to the top....
On the downstroke - You are attempting to use the sequenced release of the swinger 4-2-3 which you do, but because your head isn't in its correct location, you are forced to disrupt the clubhead orbit (geometry of the circle) and steer(the first snare) which means you are always teetering on the edge of having throwaway.
Hope this helps
Mathew
Thanks...I am always confused on right forearm on plane. if I put it as an extension of my shaft the shaft butt points up more. Is that what it's suppose to look like?
Very nice...and definately powerfull...swing. Thanks for putting it up. I'd hazard a guess...you play of (high) singles?
I'm not too well versed in TGM, so I might say something funny, but here goes:
It looks (to me) that your first move off the ball in BS is more straight away than up the inclined plane. Also, from you address position (the classic low hands) I guess that you don't do 8-(1)2 Impact Fix?
I have a constant problem of crowding the ball, if I don't do Impact Fix. When I try to hit ball of my toes I also have the straight away start.
So, is it possible you stand too close to the ball? Going to Impact Fix should tell.
From down-the-line view it is rather clear that your right hip is blocking your right elbow. Look at release right in the middle of the wanoleb.mov clip. I can't get the frame numbers, but it's in the middle.
This probably is the cause for any left field oriented ball flights.
And would fit-in, sorta, with you standing too close.
From the other view, it seems you drive your hips to the right...Hard. Maybe too hard? Looks, and again it could just be me...or camera angle, like you have too much slide and not enough turn in the hips. This can cause the right hip road block one can see in down-the-line view.
It has probably something to do w/ maintaining your balance in down swing. A bit like automatic cross line hip action I guess.
Please take this with a grain of salt:
I'm not G.S.E.D. - I'm H.A.C.K.
Vaako
I'm not too well versed in TGM, so I might say something funny, but here goes:
It looks (to me) that your first move off the ball in BS is more straight away than up the inclined plane. Also, from you address position (the classic low hands) I guess that you don't do 8-(1)2 Impact Fix?
I have a constant problem of crowding the ball, if I don't do Impact Fix. When I try to hit ball of my toes I also have the straight away start.
So, is it possible you stand too close to the ball? Going to Impact Fix should tell.
From down-the-line view it is rather clear that your right hip is blocking your right elbow. Look at release right in the middle of the wanoleb.mov clip. I can't get the frame numbers, but it's in the middle.
This probably is the cause for any left field oriented ball flights.
And would fit-in, sorta, with you standing too close.
From the other view, it seems you drive your hips to the right...Hard. Maybe too hard? Looks, and again it could just be me...or camera angle, like you have too much slide and not enough turn in the hips. This can cause the right hip road block one can see in down-the-line view.
It has probably something to do w/ maintaining your balance in down swing. A bit like automatic cross line hip action I guess.
Please take this with a grain of salt:
I'm not G.S.E.D. - I'm H.A.C.K.
Vaako
I welcome all opinions. This swing is pre-tgm, so you know where I am coming from. I see most of my faults, but how to fix them is where I struggle. I think getting my right elbow on plane at address might prevent me from standing too close. I noticed that the few times I tried the on plane forearm.
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
wanole...the main thing is the setup. Read brian's setup article and setup like that. Use a mirror to get your right forearm on plane and just let your swing happen.
Most of my concentration is just making sure my setup is good, axis tilt is correct, length from the ball is correct, and i'm good.
The minute i start to have mental breakdown of my setup i lose control and hit bad shots.
Most of my concentration is just making sure my setup is good, axis tilt is correct, length from the ball is correct, and i'm good.
The minute i start to have mental breakdown of my setup i lose control and hit bad shots.
Mathew, the clubshaft and right forearm should be on the turned shoulder plane at address? I can see how thats possible without having straight arms and an incredibly upright club. Ive been setting up with right forearm matching the shaft, but well below the turned shoulder plane. My right shoulder traces the turned shoulder plane, but thats all. if my idea of the tunred shoulder plane is all wrong, then i need to start again at zero
In the ideal application of zero shift .... I believe so...
The inclined plane of 1-L in human equivalent is the turned shoulder plane ... The clubface can open or close on this plane (swivels and hinge actions) but the clubshaft never leaves it....
The clubshaft rests on the plane at address and as the right forearm is always an angled extension of the clubshaft. This angle is formed by the impact fix degree of bend and the wrist is vertical to the plane ... so therefore the clubshaft and the forearm should point directly where your right shoulder should go.....
When the clubshaft travels up the inclined plane the position of the forearm changes and the relationship to bend in the right forearm and clubshaft (forming the right flying wedge)changes and means the elbow will travel up the elbow plane yet the clubshaft still never leaves the turned shoulder plane. The butt end of the club will point to somewhere along the base line....
Matt Taylor
New
I really like the backswing and first 1/4 of the downswing. Gets very sloppy after that, to my untrained eye. Seems like some throwaway, some chicken winging, and a collapsing left wrist.
Very, very good until you get near the ball. I like the tempo very much as well.
But you need to fix the easy stuff -- i.e, flat left wrist.
Very, very good until you get near the ball. I like the tempo very much as well.
But you need to fix the easy stuff -- i.e, flat left wrist.
This is very good advice from Mathew. From the down the line view, your right arm is too straight. You just need more bend at the elbow. Just relax your right arm. This should get your forearm on plane. If at fix you set your your forearm above the plane via the arm being too straight, it will be difficult to achieve inside out impact without a compensation. You'll end up hitting pulls or hooks by "running out of right arm."
I'm not smart enough to make this up. This is what Yoda and Ecox have help me with. It will make a big difference.
Also, read the stuff that Yoda has written on the impact bag. Learn to keep the club behind and BELOW your hands past low point.
Your swing is sweet looking though. Nice looking move.
"At ADDRESS you have FAILED to set the wedges and the right forearm is below plane. The right forearm should ALWAYS be an angled extension of the clubshaft with that angle being the bend right wrist."
Then most tour players also fail. I can think of very few who satisfy this "requirement".
And beyond address, what about 10-6-D? In this case, either the arms or the shaft is vertical to the ground throughout the stroke, and the right forearm and shaft are NEVER aligned. Yet, Homer says, "It is extremely effective and dynamically correct."
Then most tour players also fail. I can think of very few who satisfy this "requirement".
And beyond address, what about 10-6-D? In this case, either the arms or the shaft is vertical to the ground throughout the stroke, and the right forearm and shaft are NEVER aligned. Yet, Homer says, "It is extremely effective and dynamically correct."
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