How fast is too fast?

[johngolf33]

I find it amazing that whenever I hit an errant shot a fellow player or even a golf teacher will often say "just slow it down and swing smoothly" (not you Brian). Nobody complains about how violently Tiger goes after a tee shot, or any other pro for that matter. Can anyone tell me how a player knows if he is swinging too fast? I know that slow speed usually means less distance for me and that's no fun.

Sustain the Lag,

John

 

[Michael Jacobs]

Depends

Depends:

If training - only as fast as you can monitor what you are doing

If at expert pattern familiarity --- use your imagination

 

[Bigwill]

I think it's an illusion. I've watched a lot of long drive guys hit, in person and on film, and you'd be surprised at how "slow" a 140-150 mph swing could look. I think that when people see someone who's "too quick", they're seeing a lack of smoothness or efficiency, or balance issues. I've heard it said that if you slow down a bad swing, then all you'll have is a slow, bad swing. Granted, you can be out of control, but I think it has more to do with the swing itself.

 

[johngolf33]

I may be wrong about this but I think a swing is only too fast when it's too fast for the player to sustain the lag pressure on the #3 pressure point.

 

[puttmad]

I was told (a long time ago!..) that you were swinging too fast when your left elbow is forced to collapse too much at the top of the swing...

 

[irnst]

I think most of the the "speed" (we see) in the swing comes from mostly the arms doing more than the body... I see the "better" players using the "speed" of the body as the arms follow.



irnst

 

[Burner]

I may be wrong about this but I think a swing is only too fast when it's too fast for the player to sustain the lag pressure on the #3 pressure point.

John,

I am with Bigwill on this. Swing speed does not come from effort but efficiency and smoothness. You may be surprised, yourself, at how effortless your best drives actually are.

Beware PP3! It is a monitoring medium only but often, certainly in my case, it becomes the villain of the piece when it tries to exceed its brief and and add to the swing effort.

 

[johngolf33]

I agree that #3ppt is not a means of adding power to the swing, but if I am using a pivot powered hand controlled procedure I want to know how much I can rev it up without losing the lag pressure.

 

[Leek]

My favorite was the time a teaching pro friend of mine was showing me tour swings and timing. He put Ernie Els on screen, then a student. He started both swings together. Els was at impact before the student got to the top. He picked Els because of the perception that Els swing slowly.

I told him he must have a student with a very slow backswing. He then videod MY swing, put me next to Els- almost the same thing, I was at the top, Ernie was at impact, if he started our takeaways together.

In fact, if I remember correctly, Els's tempo was about the same as Nick Price's who looks downright violent to my naked eye. Also about the same as Tigers! I've come to realize Els looks so slow because his swing must be very efficient with no extra movements.

After that, for a while I worked on a faster backswing. It created much more lag, a shorter backswing and usually better impact, but I just didn't have confidence in that tempo and got away from it. As my fundamentals improve, I am now going back that direction.

 

[Bigwill]

If any of you have a chance when Ernie is playing, get up out of your chair and try to match Ernie's tempo. I think a lot of people would be surprised at how fast they'd have to move to match him from address to the top, and from the top to impact. There are a lot of illusions and misconceptions involved with the golf swing, which is why it's important to trust your swing to an experienced set of eyes (or ears, as I discovered while talking on the phone to Brian).

 

[puttmad]

Ernie swings at 24/8 (in Tour Tempo terms).. That's about the same as Tiger...but slower than Nick Price (21/7)..

One thing they found about Tiger...his tempo is the same for every shot, including fractional pitches and chips....

 

[tourdeep]

Too much focus is given to mechanics and not enuf to tempo. Not saying that mechanics is not important, cuz it is. It just gets lost in the shuffle amongst the array of categorized stinking thinkings...

The smooth operators on tour, if you really look at their core, they are giving it some to a lot of umpph. But their dynamic balance, the smoothness of their transitional choreography is the best in the world. The ummph is well disguised under the blanket of a tempo that matches their makeup.

The tour tempo relationship of 3:1 (from takeaway to the top and from the top to impact) seems fairly consistent and suggests a flaw with most of the non-pros, having hiccups in the backswing. But, always exceptions to the rule. Just ask Nancy Lopez or Bob Murphy.

Feeling as if one is swinging 3/4's (or less) with tour tempo relationship surprises me how far my hands still get back and up.

 

[flapro]

Els height makes his swing look slower because there is more distance to travel, also, his large frame hides the speed with the bulk moving seemingly slower.
Its an optical illusion and nothing else.

If any of you have a chance when Ernie is playing, get up out of your chair and try to match Ernie's tempo. I think a lot of people would be surprised at how fast they'd have to move to match him from address to the top, and from the top to impact. There are a lot of illusions and misconceptions involved with the golf swing, which is why it's important to trust your swing to an experienced set of eyes (or ears, as I discovered while talking on the phone to Brian).

 

[Kevin Shields]

It's probably over simplified, but i generally think of tempo like this. If you load the club well , dump down the force and your swing naturally "runs out of gas", you probably look smooth ( Ernie Els ). If you over-accelerate, throw it away on the way down, and speed up your arms at impact for power, you'll most likely look quick (even if you're Nick Price)

 

[tank]

Els height makes his swing look slower because there is more distance to travel, also, his large frame hides the speed with the bulk moving seemingly slower.
Its an optical illusion and nothing else.

With more distance to travel in the same time frame, would that not require more speed, and therefore make his swing look faster? Just asking.

 

[Leek]

Els height makes his swing look slower because there is more distance to travel, also, his large frame hides the speed with the bulk moving seemingly slower.
Its an optical illusion and nothing else.

That defies the laws of physics. In order to travel farther in the same time frame, an object must move faster.

I've seen Els hit drivers from 10 feet away. It is amazing how quiet his body is. He has a pretty big pivot with no wasted motion. He just pivots, stores and then pivots through. It is truly amazing to see up close.

 

[puttmad]

...

I find it amazing how late he rotates his left arm back to square for impact....

 

[johngolf33]

Does anyone have a drill or excersize to increase Pivot speed?

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Does anyone have a drill or excersize to increase Pivot speed?

Um...just do it faster. that's like asking how do you swing a bat faster. Just put more umph into it.

 

[tongzilla]

Does anyone have a drill or excersize to increase Pivot speed?

Cross your arms like superman, then get into a golf like position and pivot back an forth. Maintain good tempo and try to speed things up gradually. Pivot should work the same with or without a ball