johngolf33
New
When I look at golf on TV and they measure club head speed the pros generate significant speed. If I am trying to increase my CHS how would I know when I have gone too far for ME?
How Fast Is Too Fast?
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otto6457
New
You didn't specify Manzella Academy only so I assume you are just looking for generic ideas from non-professional teachers. 
I see several markers for swinging too hard in a golfer.
1) Loss of balance. Solid balance encourages good swing speed.
2) Loss of sweet spot contact due to loss of control of the club head. Trying to swing too fast makes pure contact very difficult.
3) Big slices or hooks due to loss of club face control. Trying to swing too fast makes it very difficult to square the club face. Control is lost due to your body fighting balance issues and the resulting loss of timing. The sequence of your swing provides the maximum club head speed and trying to swing faster often interrupts that sequence.
I'm sure there are a lot more.
Club head speed has more to do with efficient motion than swinging harder. Just watch J.B.Holmes and his 3/4 back swing and you will see great balance, great control, and really high club head speed.
Just remember.....I am not a teaching professional, but I have stayed in a Holiday Inn.
I see several markers for swinging too hard in a golfer.
1) Loss of balance. Solid balance encourages good swing speed.
2) Loss of sweet spot contact due to loss of control of the club head. Trying to swing too fast makes pure contact very difficult.
3) Big slices or hooks due to loss of club face control. Trying to swing too fast makes it very difficult to square the club face. Control is lost due to your body fighting balance issues and the resulting loss of timing. The sequence of your swing provides the maximum club head speed and trying to swing faster often interrupts that sequence.
I'm sure there are a lot more.
Club head speed has more to do with efficient motion than swinging harder. Just watch J.B.Holmes and his 3/4 back swing and you will see great balance, great control, and really high club head speed.
Just remember.....I am not a teaching professional, but I have stayed in a Holiday Inn.
If you are talking about actual clubhead speed, I don't think it can be too fast. Effort level is a different story, and Otto gave a good list of some of the things to take into consideration when trying to determine your maximum controllable effort level. Some people (mostly better players, I would guess), can play very well within themselves swinging at 90%. Others lose control swinging at that high an effort level. So I would say to get your top clubhead speed as high as you're capable, then determine how much of that speed you can control effectively on the course.
cmartingolf
New
Oddly
I've had some of my best driving days when in scrambles and I'm trying to rip the snot out of it. I know there is little consequence in scrambles, but it's amazing how solid and long (for me) I hit it! Not too many lost balls.
Guess I'm a mental midget during real rounds to hit it that hard. My 85-90% swing hits the ball MORE crooked
I've had some of my best driving days when in scrambles and I'm trying to rip the snot out of it. I know there is little consequence in scrambles, but it's amazing how solid and long (for me) I hit it! Not too many lost balls.
Guess I'm a mental midget during real rounds to hit it that hard. My 85-90% swing hits the ball MORE crooked
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
honestly you just have to practice various levels of "effort" with a swing speed radar and figure out how YOU create speed. In a lot of cases swinging "harder" won't translate into swinging "faster." on another note, even though better players might "look" like they are not swinging hard because it looks so smooth they are. I know because people tell me something similar but trust me I'm expending some effort.
johngolf33
New
Thanks Jim. That sounds reasonable. I'll do some trial and error.
birdie_man
New
Gotta find what works best for you.
I've had some of my best driving days when in scrambles and I'm trying to rip the snot out of it. I know there is little consequence in scrambles, but it's amazing how solid and long (for me) I hit it! Not too many lost balls.
Guess I'm a mental midget during real rounds to hit it that hard. My 85-90% swing hits the ball MORE crooked
I've had the same issue. I always hit the ball straighter when I'm trying to hit it really hard, particularly with the driver. As a matter of fact, the best that I've ever hit driver were the times I was competing in long drive competitions. Aren't you supposed to hit it less consistently when you're going after it? Go figure...
I had a lesson with a golfing machine GSED and he told me to try and hit it harder !!!!. The theory was that there was less chance of steering and trying to intentionally manipulate the clubhead.
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
I've told students that before, a lot times when people try to "slow down" they end up quitting and steering some how.
Ain't that the truth. Once I got one, I tried all the different ways I "feel" when swinging. Of course, some "feel" like they create more speed. They don't for me.
FWIW, Hogan said you can't turn the hips too fast. That's pretty definitive.
He also said that while giving lessons he would tell students Harder! Harder! Harder!
I think the tendency with a controlled swing for most golfers is their hands get lazy at impact. We mistake controlled and regulated for spineless. At the last moment, most golfers realize that they have not generated any power with their "controlled" swing, because they probably aren't firing their hips to begin with and now it's become obvious, so they make a last moment lash as the ball to generate CHS. This has been the case for me in the past.
HOWEVER, since really trying to feel the snap and drive of the hips, I have found that my arms have "slowed" way down. My balance is perfect and my ball striking firm, long and straight. I have had to make the arms understand that they will be needed when called upon, mostly when the hips have left the building.
So, to quote Hogan and to provide advice from my own personal experience, you should turn your hips like they are on fire and let the upper torso follow suit. You want to feel that left hip fire around and back. This prevents any chance of deceleration and hand manipulation. The swing is over before you know it.
Finally, Brian talks about being able to distinguish good golfers from bad the moment you see them swing. Watch their hips. You can't hide how fast they are turning because they are turning at such a slow rate of motion compared to the arms. After I saw Brian say that, I watched some fellow hackers on the range. I could quickly discern most of their swing faults by watching their hips first. This is because their compensations become obvious. We can never turn our hips too fast. That's an amazing and encouraging thought from the Master himself.
He also said that while giving lessons he would tell students Harder! Harder! Harder!
I think the tendency with a controlled swing for most golfers is their hands get lazy at impact. We mistake controlled and regulated for spineless. At the last moment, most golfers realize that they have not generated any power with their "controlled" swing, because they probably aren't firing their hips to begin with and now it's become obvious, so they make a last moment lash as the ball to generate CHS. This has been the case for me in the past.
HOWEVER, since really trying to feel the snap and drive of the hips, I have found that my arms have "slowed" way down. My balance is perfect and my ball striking firm, long and straight. I have had to make the arms understand that they will be needed when called upon, mostly when the hips have left the building.
So, to quote Hogan and to provide advice from my own personal experience, you should turn your hips like they are on fire and let the upper torso follow suit. You want to feel that left hip fire around and back. This prevents any chance of deceleration and hand manipulation. The swing is over before you know it.
Finally, Brian talks about being able to distinguish good golfers from bad the moment you see them swing. Watch their hips. You can't hide how fast they are turning because they are turning at such a slow rate of motion compared to the arms. After I saw Brian say that, I watched some fellow hackers on the range. I could quickly discern most of their swing faults by watching their hips first. This is because their compensations become obvious. We can never turn our hips too fast. That's an amazing and encouraging thought from the Master himself.
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While you share some good insights, remember that there are NO absolutes in the swing except "what the club's tellin' the ball."
One CAN turn their hips too fast, especially if it's too soon. And for some people, a faster hip turn may not produce more speed; in some cases I'm sure it produces less speed.
Brian Manzella
Administrator
How fast is TOO FAST?
When you start hitting it worse.
Johnny Miller called it the "Red Line."
But really—technically, you can't swing too fast.
You can' t turn you hips too fast early, but you can keep them turning fast too long (no KS).
When you start hitting it worse.
Johnny Miller called it the "Red Line."
But really—technically, you can't swing too fast.
You can' t turn you hips too fast early, but you can keep them turning fast too long (no KS).
Jayro1
New
Kinetic snap?
speedracer68
New
whey you don't have KS...do you usually push the ball?
I'm striving for a FLT and opening the body at impact..it works like a charm..i find the release happens loong after impact..it feels great the ball flys much lower and very straight..is that the way it should be?
I'm striving for a FLT and opening the body at impact..it works like a charm..i find the release happens loong after impact..it feels great the ball flys much lower and very straight..is that the way it should be?
self-mastery
New
I try to throw the clubhead as fast as possible... My body finds the right position to deliver the blow. My swing is all about momentum.
speedracer68
New
Throw?..what does a throw feel like..I personally try to keep all angles with constant rotation..
I'm just trying to get as much info as possible..
I'm just trying to get as much info as possible..
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