Need help fixing friend's swing

[Jwat]

I have been trying to help a buddy of mine with his swing. He swings really good one day and really bad the next. Mostly occurs with his longer clubs. He is struggling with a low pull right now and the occasional chunk. He is obviously standing up in his downswing. Any suggestions and tips would be greatly appreciated.

YouTube - IMG 0987

 

[jenhaoyen]

woah was that club face open on the down swing.
0.04 looks really open...
NSA for sure


I could be wrong but that was what it looks like to me

 

[bax1865]

Bad posture is forcing his weight to be too much toward his toes. This makes his swing too upright even with some pop out of his hands at takeaway. Get him into a more athletic stance with the ability to wiggle his toes to make him get his weight in better balance. Reatrict the amount of hip turn going back.....waaaaay too much hip turn......I'll bet the farm that his spine angle at the top is tilted in front of the ball. Needs help with setup, lower body pivot and a better turn behind the ball with left shoulder. Have him make a few swings pretending the ball is teed up 2 feet off the ground so he can get the feel of a little more roundness and turn rather than lift. Good luck

 

[Jwat]

Bad posture is forcing his weight to be too much toward his toes. This makes his swing too upright even with some pop out of his hands at takeaway. Get him into a more athletic stance with the ability to wiggle his toes to make him get his weight in better balance. Reatrict the amount of hip turn going back.....waaaaay too much hip turn......I'll bet the farm that his spine angle at the top is tilted in front of the ball. Needs help with setup, lower body pivot and a better turn behind the ball with left shoulder. Have him make a few swings pretending the ball is teed up 2 feet off the ground so he can get the feel of a little more roundness and turn rather than lift. Good luck

Great post, I can now see all of these things in his swing. There were just so many things wrong it is hard to pick out which ones are the most important for him to work on first.

 

[Jwat]

woah was that club face open on the down swing.
0.04 looks really open...
NSA for sure


I could be wrong but that was what it looks like to me

I wasn't even looking at the open clubface since he hooks the dog out of the ball. He incorporates the twisting down or holding the twist in the downswing which is why I think he gets the clubface back to square.

Since he is closing it down so much on the downswing should he back off that some and work some twistaway on backswing?

 

[jenhaoyen]

I wasn't even looking at the open clubface since he hooks the dog out of the ball. He incorporates the twisting down or holding the twist in the downswing which is why I think he gets the clubface back to square.

Since he is closing it down so much on the downswing should he back off that some and work some twistaway on backswing?

well i think if you open a bunch it can lead to hooking as well, because you would try to flip it in order to square the club face or to save it.

 

[Jwat]

The fact that couldn't see some of the things that the instructors
saw, and you are unsure of what to recommend means that you
may do more harm than good.

You might suggest that your friend spend some money on lessons.

Just my opinion.

I don't think anyone especially a single digit handicapper helping their friend who has a 14 handicap is doing any harm. I live in an area where there is no good golf instructors. I look on this site several times a week. What I meant about not seeing some of the faults in his swing was from watching him swing live. Obviously you can see the faults in the video.

Damn, what a hypocrite. Isn't that what this site is for?

 

[Jwat]

well i think if you open a bunch it can lead to hooking as well, because you would try to flip it in order to square the club face or to save it.

Makes total sense. Another guy was trying to teach him that pop out move to start the swing to help keep it closed. I think it is just a temporary fix.

 

[greenfree]

Hands a bit lower at address , get that bowed left wrist to relax and get the head of the club up above his hands instead of them been in a straight line half way back in the b.s./takeaway approximately between the 3 & 4 sec. mark.

He is trying to get the club up without using his wrists thus all the body lifting and leaning left on the b.s. then on the d.s. he has to crunch all the lifting back down and then back up. He senses no leverage thus all the body lifting.

 

[greenfree]

JWAT, I guess you thought I was saying that I was an instructor
and somehow more qualified than you to diagnose a swing. That is
not what I meant. I am not an instructor, but I sure have witnessed
some amateur instruction between buddies over my now 5 decades of playing golf.
I have tried to help people if they asked. Results have mostly been non-existent
because they weren't willing to do the work or, perhaps my help was harmful.

This is forum. All I did was offer an opinion. You don't have to accept
it, but you might want to think about what I said. Doesn't mean you shouldn't try.
No good instructors in your area would be a good reason to try, but who knew that was the situation.

You said, "I don't think anyone especially a single digit handicapper helping their friend who has a 14 handicap is doing any harm. " Really? In a following post you mention someone showing your friend the pop-out move. Was
that helpful or harmful? I only point this out as food for thought. You have a couple of posters offering up some solutions with enough complexity to cause your friend's eyes to glaze over.

Then you have an instructor, Bax, clearly saying do this, because of this. Because of all the
inter-related causes and effects, you would be well advised to apply Bax's steps and not worry
about the other tips until you see what happens when your friend try's the changes. He actually looks
fairly athletic. Reminds me of Carl Peterson's look, which works pretty well.

Good luck with your friend and I didn't mean to ruffle your feathers.

Since the only other 2 posters are Jen and myself i guess you are referring to us. There's nothing i said that is any more complex and eye glazing than what Bax suggested and actually more simple, work on the cause not the 20 effects.

There's nothing you or i or Bax can do except offer opinions that's what Jwat asked for and he got some, he can ignore them or try them on his friend.

On the one hand you apologize to Jwat but in the same post you manage to insult both Jen and me, so in the end Jwat was correct with his first statement about you.

 

[Jwat]

No biggie. I do agree that even an ounce of bad advice can be detremental to anyones swing. But I would consider the information I get on this forum to be far superior than any of the pros in this area. Does that mean I can apply it correctly with him? Maybe not, but what other forum can you go to online and get this much good feedback?

What Bax said was on point and I really appreciate his comments. But for a guy who really follows this forum all the time, Soft I was suprised you were to trying to route me to the local pro. You know better than I that this forum offers 10 times what a local could do.

 

[lookingtolearn]

I would also take a look at his grip. It looks like it may be too weak and/or he doesn't have the heel pad on top enough.

 

[jenhaoyen]

woah no need to pointing fingers! we are all one big happy family!

 

[greenfree]

Steve, thanks for that, i understand the tinkering thing, i think you are not alone in that..lol
Forum's are a place to exchange idea's among other things and it's up to the individual if they want to use them or not and yes some can be not good for that person or some can that's the chance you take when you buy your ticket at the gate...lol

 

[Jwat]

But this is the problem everyone has with your post Soft, we all want each other's help. Whether you think we are qualifed or not to teach it to someone else it doesn't matter. Just because you haven't had success with other amateurs doesn't mean that we won't.

I didn't post up a swing and ask for only instructor comments like some do. Most of the time the instructors dont respond to my posts. Hell, I have had prolly 8 lessons with Brian in the last couple of years and can't even get the guy to reply back to me on my swing. After each lesson it is always like, "Please call or email me with any questions". Over 2 years I never ever asked anything, but a few weeks ago when I asked for a short comment on my swing still no reponse.

So for some of us this forum is all we got. Isn't that the idea? Isn't that what Brian ultimatly wanted? To spread the knowledge to everyone?

Your putting golf instructors up on some pedistal like they are the only ones that can see flaws and help someone. To me a golf swing is taught by relating to someones flawed swing and curving it into something better not perfect but better. And yes the instructors are best fit to do that, but I will take these guys on the forum any day of the week especially the regulars when the other isn't available.

I like others have a big problem with the way this forum is evolving. We are so worried about science now instead of helping people that really this forum caters to people who want to learn the science of the swing and not how to improve. 6 months ago this wasn't the case, but the swing symosium that is supposed to change the world so far has only changed the site. Now we have a bunch of users that hide behind their name and shoot out negative posts non stop.

I miss the old forum where a guy can post up a swing and genuinely get help by people who care about this game.

 

[Richie3Jack]

I think the driver is way too long for him. That takes away his waist bend and causes a super flat shoulder turn.




3JACK

 

[Jwat]

I think the driver is way too long for him. That takes away his waist bend and causes a super flat shoulder turn.




3JACK

Thanks for the feedback. I will have him try to choke down an inch or two on his driver to see. He really hits his irons and hybrids pretty solid. Just the driver gives him mixed feedback.

 

[Richie3Jack]

Thanks for the feedback. I will have him try to choke down an inch or two on his driver to see. He really hits his irons and hybrids pretty solid. Just the driver gives him mixed feedback.

I think he's better off trying some shorter shafted drivers and see what he thinks becaue choking down isn't exactly a good remedy because of the weight of the club, effective lie angle, etc.





3JACK

 

[Jwat]

Soft, you just have way too much time on your hands. I love this forum and am not going anywhere. I am allowed an opinion just as you. I originally asked for some thoughts on a guy's swing. You have turned it into something way more than what it should be. You love to argue and know one will ever win with you over an internet discussion. Yes some of my thoughts are incomplete or just not gramatically correct because I don't have hours to type a complete thought and proof-read it.

But I will say that when someone asks for advice about something if you don't have advice then don't waste everyone's time with your non-sense. Dont criticize everyone's opinion with your baseless opinion. Most people are on here to learn not argue. Maybe we should nominate you for the Manzella debate team, of course you would be on the B team.

 

[Jwat]

I agree that the thread is now off your topic, and that I contributed
to the wandering. However, you also contributed. If you had simply
read my initial post, ignored my thought, and not posted your response,
then I would have never posted anything further. Think about it.
So sorry Comrade, that I dared to suggest anything other than swing related thoughts.
Shame on me. Feeling like I am a Chinese dissident.

I have removed my posts on this thread

Dude you are really full of it. Thanks for wasting everyone's time with your pointless posts, then deleting them cause you know how stupid they were. And thank you for taking another thread off subject.