Effortless wedges, but not the same with longer clubs

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dsmith2296

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Ok, I just posted this issue, but nobody responded. Either I wasn't making sense or the topic was boring. Anyway, I need some help.

If you look at this, I think I am lagging pretty well- hitting effortless wedges 125 yards+ , but I am pulling the longer clubs really bad and they are really low. Does anybody see a reason why?

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiGhvK7FpxA[/media]
 
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Zztop

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dsmith2296 said:
Ok, I just posted this issue, but nobody responded. Either I wasn't making sense or the topic was boring. Anyway, I need some help.

If you look at this, I think I am lagging pretty well- hitting effortless wedges 125 yards+ , but I am pulling the longer clubs really bad and they are really low. Does anybody see a reason why?

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiGhvK7FpxA[/media]
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Hard to see but it looks like a so called shut clubface at the top, at impact i can't tell could be delofted and closed more than you would like, looks like a knockdown action. Do you have a strong grip or more neutral grip? Maybe the real experts can comment for you. Since wedges have more loft than long irons you don't notice it that much with them. On the lighter side, i think your hula hoop is in the ground to long.
 
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Zztop

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ggsjpc said:
A swing with no ball is not a swing we can analyze. Try to add one when you are hitting it.
Click to expand...

The neighbours might not like it. :D Also people make swing analysis without video all the time on this forum, what does that say?
 
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ej20

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dsmith2296 said:
Ok, I just posted this issue, but nobody responded. Either I wasn't making sense or the topic was boring. Anyway, I need some help.

If you look at this, I think I am lagging pretty well- hitting effortless wedges 125 yards+ , but I am pulling the longer clubs really bad and they are really low. Does anybody see a reason why?

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiGhvK7FpxA[/media]
Click to expand...

Well first off how about a look at the driver swing.You say you're having problems with the longer clubs so why post a swing with the club your not having trouble with.

Perhaps you are delofting like crazy as your wedge distances are quite impressive.

Over delofting will cause problems with longer clubs.
 
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dsmith2296

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I do believe that at least some conversation can be had with the swing that I am NOT having problems with. If you pause the downswing, you should be able to see that I do have a scintilla of lag and trigger delay.... and yes I am probably delofting a PW into a 9.5 iron.

The problem I am having is with the FLW- I cannot achieve that float loading/angle storage with a FLW. My wrist has to bend considerably to do it.

Perhaps I am going from bent to arched and that's why I am delofting, I don't know. But I will tell you this, I have been on this site for almost 5 years and my quest to maintain a FLW has prevented me from achieving the storage you see in this simple wedge shot. I have determined that, for me, it requires I bent left wrist.
 
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Jon Hardesty

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The clubface is closed at the top. You could be a little under plane on the downswing, but I really can't tell because of the face on camera angle. Also, if you really beat down on your irons, you could have some D-plane issues. Hope this helps.
 
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ej20

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Maybe you need to reduce the lag and get a FLW.If you cannot get those sorts of angles without a massively bent left wrist then really there is nothing you can do.

Hogan got his angle but he wasn't that cupped...closer to flat than cupped.He must have had enormously flexible wrists.I know I can't get those angles with a flat left wrist.

You don't need silly lag to play good golf.Ninety degrees is plenty.
 
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dsmith2296

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Interesting issue of trading off lag for a FLW. I just don't like fanning the clubface open and my FLW being flat on the swing plane in a "karate chop" position. I can't store the angle and I throw it away immediately. Plus, I don't like having to worry about re-squaring the club face up.

I don't like the idea of having two separate patterns though. I really like this pattern inside 165 yards, but no so much when I go longer.
 
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ej20

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You don't necessarily need to fan the clubface open on the takeaway.There is no need to flatten the left wrist from the get go.Whats the rush?Flatten it when your hands reach about shoulder height or wherever you feel comfortable.

Not many great players have a severe bent left wrist at the top of the backswing.
 
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dsmith2296

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Did you see where nickw511 posted his swing on the $800 lesson thread? I thought that he had a very FLW throughout his swing. Up until about two months ago, my swing videos resembled his with regard to the FLW and the angle storage. (I'm not busting your chops, Nick- just drawing a comparison/contrast for the purposes of theoretical discussion).

Also note that I believe I am going straight from bent to arched, bypassing flat. I think the bent position allows me to store the angle.-

Right now, I am not willing to give up the bent left wrist because of the lag it helps me achieve. Maybe its like steroids in that regard-- favorable results in power, but at what cost?

Can anybody show me a video of wicked angle storage from a guy with a FLW?
 
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ej20

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Flattening the left wrist too early leads to pop out and getting the clubhead behind the hands too early.I just had a look at nickw511's swing and thats exactly what hes doing.

One of the goals of the lagging clubhead takeaway is to avoid this.

Sergio Garcia is known for very supple wrists.
 
birdie_man

birdie_man

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Zztop said:
The neighbours might not like it. :D Also people make swing analysis without video all the time on this forum, what does that say?
Click to expand...

You can infer what the clubhead is doing from ballflight zz. But when you swing without hitting a ball it's possible to do things that you couldn't otherwise do. (Brian has always said you can swing as though there is no clubface to control)

That being said...without a ball I think I could give a decent idea of how I swing.

I suspect I could also dupe you into thinking I am capable of Sergio-like lag. I can't tell you I'm 100% sure but it would be an interesting video experiment...
 
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Zztop

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birdie_man said:
You can infer what the clubhead is doing from ballflight zz. But when you swing without hitting a ball it's possible to do things that you couldn't otherwise do. (Brian has always said you can swing as though there is no clubface to control)

That being said...without a ball I think I could give a decent idea of how I swing.

I suspect I could also dupe you into thinking I am capable of Sergio-like lag. I can't tell you I'm 100% sure but it would be an interesting video experiment...
Click to expand...

You got it all wrong Birdieman, i was commenting on his description of ball flight, pulled and low with longer irons, not the lag. Not hitting a ball on the video had nothing to do with it. The comment of his i'm sure was when he was hitting balls, otherwise how could he describe the flight or direction? He had posted a previous thread describing his problem without video and got no response, so he decided to post a video, big deal!

I guess you can only believe what someone is telling you or you don't. The duped part is between you and him ,i never commented on the Sergio- like lag, but it's interesting that you did. People give swing advice from what other people are describing, without video or actually seeing it live all the time, either side could be duped in this activity.
 
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Zztop

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Also the PM that you sent me a while back was i been duped by what you told me in that? I'm not sure, now you went and made me all paranoid or am i just trying to dupe you with my response to your PM? It's a slippery slope when you go there Birdieman.
 
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