Swing Comments?

[Kerry Falk]

Hi Folks,

I have been told that I can find some fellow analytically minded people here and they might be able to provide a little more insight into how to improve my swing.

I have a couple of problems that I'm working on right now and feel like I'm getting close to fixing but I'd love to hear what you all think. I won't divulge too much info yet as you may see something I hadn't even considered but I'd be happy to answer any questions.

A little info on my ball flight and game:

- My 5 iron is my 200 yard club
- a good drive for me is a little over 300 yards, I average somewhere between 260-270
- I hit my short irons very high (too high)
- My ball flight is generally straight with a fade (On weird occasions a strong pull fade) and when I really go after the ball I hit a draw
- I've been playing for nearly 20 years but only recently started really trying to improve my swing, I can shoot 80s but have never shot under 80. I want to get to scratch.

Here's a vid from today:

<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/28467887?title=0&byline=0&portrait=0" width="504" height="883" frameborder="0"></iframe>

That swing was with a 7 iron and is a little shorter in distance than I'm used to, it's the most recent example of what I'm trying to do to fix my swing (The other videos can be seen on Vimeo). All of these ended up as 150 yard push-fades.

Thoughts?

 

[birdie_man]

What happens w the short irons?

Welcome to the forum.

 

[Kerry Falk]

Typically I hit them very high and very straight. With the swing that I have been working with for a while I have a hard time hitting a 56 degree wedge farther than 60 yards with a full swing - which is odd because I can hit a fairly long ball with the other clubs (I hit a 7 iron 165-170). When I miss any of the short irons I hit a big push. Not a slice, a big push.

This is the swing that I'm working on now:

<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/28662535?title=0&byline=0&portrait=0" width="504" height="883" frameborder="0"></iframe>
<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/28662517?title=0&byline=0&portrait=0" width="504" height="883" frameborder="0"></iframe>

It has taken a whole bunch of yards off my clubs but I'm really accurate with it and it feels easier to be consistent. These videos were from yesterday. I had a bit of trouble on course because I was picking the wrong club, I left everything short of the green (I hit 28% GIR). I don't think I was able to hit a 7 iron farther than about 145 with this swing. I want to keep at it until I get my distance back though because it feels more connected and looks like a healthier swing (To me).

 

[birly-shirly]

This is just my take - but if I had gone from hitting my 5 iron 200 yards, to hitting a 7 iron 145 at most, I'd want to be really sure of what I was working on.

145 isn't horrible, but you've lost a lot of distance. I don't think I'd want to give up that yardage for either "connectedness" or a "healthier looking" swing. I'd think it should be possible to identify the ballflight tendency that's hurting me the most and set about that in terms of clubface or path issues - rather than working towards a better-looking swing.

For what it's worth - from your initial description of your game, you were already hitting the ball better than I do but scoring worse. And I'm no short game genius. So are you sure that your (old) swing is what's holding you back?

 

[Kerry Falk]

Thanks for the reply, birly-shirly. It is a lot of distance, I was hitting my 5 iron ~180 yesterday. But all of the shots were perfectly on target, very few strays. The consistency was far better with this swing than with my other swing. If the distance was the same as before (And therefore I was picking the right club) I think I would have shot one of my best games.

I do think the old swing is what was holding me back - lots of my friends think I hit amazing recovery shots. That's because I _need_ to hit amazing recovery shots because my swing made it really hard to be consistent. Although I'd hit it long it was really dependent on the timing of my wrists which meant on one shot I'd hit a push-fade and the very next shot I'd hit a pull-draw (unintentionally). I got good enough that I wouldn't end up in the bush but I'd be constantly scrambling. What saved my scores (If you can call it that) is that I'm fairly decent at chipping (I have been chipping in almost one ball a game from 10-20 yards off the green).

This one is making me deathly accurate. I think I just need my distance back. For reference, here's the old swing with a driver. This particular hit looks like I didn't really hit the ball on the face properly but I would average around 270 yards like this and when I really went after it I could hit draws in the 300 range.

<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/28035641?title=0&byline=0&portrait=0" width="504" height="883" frameborder="0"></iframe>

I live in Canada's winter wonderland and we have a fairly short golfing season (5 months). So when I get back out again every year it takes me a while to get the timing right so that I can actually hit the ball I'd like something that is a little easier for me to get the timing right - the swing I was using yesterday feels much more like it will be easier to be consistent.

 

[birly-shirly]

I'm not the expert, but smart folks round here seem to put two-way misses down to being underplane in the downswing. Search the forum for "underplane" and you'll turn up a wealth of reading. The good news is, I can't remember anyone complaining about losing a bunch of clubhead speed.

 

[Kerry Falk]

I'm not the expert, but smart folks round here seem to put two-way misses down to being underplane in the downswing. Search the forum for "underplane" and you'll turn up a wealth of reading. The good news is, I can't remember anyone complaining about losing a bunch of clubhead speed.

I'm fairly confident it's entirely due to the release of my hands and timing with the rest of my body. If I would release too late I would end up with a fade and if I released too early a draw. The pull/push was dependent on the timing of my arms with the twist of my hips, arms first = pull / hips first = push. I got good enough that I could start to actively control it (sort of) but really it just followed how tired I was. Early in the game I'd hit pull/fades (My first drive of the day was almost always a really nice 280 yard pull/fade) and then later in the game I'd start hitting draws and pull/draws with a few fades/slices just to screw with me. Really tough to plan how to play a shot like that, I just get lucky towards the end of the game when there are some long par 5's because I'll crush a 290-300 yard pull/draw that lands somewhere I can safely approach the green.

It really is a pain to time properly as I'm learning more about it I'm finding it a little crazy that I was able to time it at all and hit the ball that long consistently enough to shoot 80s. It literally took weeks or months (depending on how often I played) to get the timing right so that I could contact the ball - none of my friends games dropped off that much between seasons. Drives me crazy.

With the swing that I'm doing now it feels so much easier to get everything working together and hit it consistently straight. I just lost a good bit of distance because I haven't learned to speed up my body yet, it used to be my arms/wrists adding the extra clubhead speed.

The videos you see above are of my swing progression over the last three weeks or so. I'm fairly malleable and can change whatever I need to so that I play better. I'm trying to gather knowledge so that I can determine what the best path for my swing is - this is feeling good though. It's so much easier to hit and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to get my distance back and maybe even add some more. Does anyone see anything that might hold me back (New swing: Baseball hat/sweater)?