An Idea and Question

[Jared Willerson]

The past several months have been an exciting time in the forum at brianmanzella.com.

The ideas on the release thread and subsequent videos and discussions have made a lot of progress in determining what really happens in the golf swing and how a person can really improve.

One of the gems that I have thought a lot about was "getting as much forward lean with as shallow of an angle of attack as possible" and of course the "toss"

A swing I look at on video from time to time is Rory McIlroy. I watched a video when Rory was younger using obviously a club that was a bit too long for him. He had a big forward press, a beautiful little toss to begin the downswing and of course he striped it.

So my idea/question is this:

Would it be helpful at all to train with a club that was really long (compared to regular clubs, say a 55 inch driver) to ingrain the feeling of a toss at the top while also getting the desired forward lean/shallow angle that is important in controlling ball flight? It seems that a golfer would have to get the club head moving sooner but would also have to be really shallow to keep the club from hitting the ground too soon.

It seems that when young prodigies develop swings they do so with clubs that are both too long and too heavy. In my observations these are the traits that develop the look of lag but also a tour level angle of attack.

What does everyone think?

 

[mjstrong]

Not based on anything, but:

I would think that the longer, training aid club would have to be specially weighted, as the increased static and swing weight would probably result in different kinetic transfer patterns (via Nesbitt's paper) than those with a normal club.

 

[hp12c]

The past several months have been an exciting time in the forum at brianmanzella.com.

The ideas on the release thread and subsequent videos and discussions have made a lot of progress in determining what really happens in the golf swing and how a person can really improve.

One of the gems that I have thought a lot about was "getting as much forward lean with as shallow of an angle of attack as possible" and of course the "toss"

A swing I look at on video from time to time is Rory McIlroy. I watched a video when Rory was younger using obviously a club that was a bit too long for him. He had a big forward press, a beautiful little toss to begin the downswing and of course he striped it.

So my idea/question is this:

Would it be helpful at all to train with a club that was really long (compared to regular clubs, say a 55 inch driver) to ingrain the feeling of a toss at the top while also getting the desired forward lean/shallow angle that is important in controlling ball flight? It seems that a golfer would have to get the club head moving sooner but would also have to be really shallow to keep the club from hitting the ground too soon.

It seems that when young prodigies develop swings they do so with clubs that are both too long and too heavy. In my observations these are the traits that develop the look of lag but also a tour level angle of attack.

What does everyone think?

Sound plausible, now for the 64dolllar questions, who gonna be the ginnie pig?

 

[94monarch]

Neat Idea...I am looking forward to hearing an experts answer. It makes sense to me.

 

[mgranato]

One of the quickest ways to change someones swing plane and the timing for their release it to change the length (and weight) of their shaft. The most notable difference would be with the driver. I see this as a classic double edged sword... probably would help some, and probably be very bad for others. The devil would seem to be in the how's and who's.

 

[Brian Manzella]

We use to try to create tons of lag and up-the-left-arm-itis with extra long clubs that would have covered shaft extending inward toward the golfer.

They were heavy, got the golfer to look good on video, and created HORRIBLE shots.

But we marched on.

Geez....

 

[Jared Willerson]

Ok, For the record the last thing I would want is up the left arm, too much lag swing.

I thought it might help with the toss to begin the downswing and learning to be more shallow. Just an idea, but for the reasons mentioned above probably not feasible. It made sense in my head though.

 

[OLIVER1]

I could see it helping with a good jump, though. With a 55" shaft you'd have to jump like you trod on a landmine so as not to release into the floor...

 

[Matt Bryda]

Jared,

I think if you get too long (55") you would create too much torque at the left wrist joint, uncontrollable for most people.

 

[Bonesy]

The orange whip is long and its flexibility would/does exacerbate the movement of a normal club. I've been using it to work on not tugging and to feel a steeper left arm at the bottom. If you tug or convulse the OW is gonna let you know about it.

 

[blehnhard]

Oliver - I played with Rocky Thompson a number of times on the Sr. Tour back in the 90's. Rocky used a 50"+ driver (Killer Bee) and left his feet at impact. Wonder if there is any video of him floating around - would be the "jump" personified.

Bruce

 

[BrendanC]

What about the relationship between the left shoulder and the clubhead, and the importance of a repeatable left side/shoulder motion for going normal.

There is a max. radius there and to me it seems that the length of the club shaft should be dictated by that, with the length of the golfers arm and the lie angle the other factors.

I think that the idea of using long clubs with a jump move seems very timing dependent and not helpful for finesse-ing shots.

 

[bcoak]

should kids learn with kids size clubs or longer? I believe you have an opinion on this BM

 

[bcoak]

A player on the pga tour now grew up at my club and he used to use adult length clubs. He had the best swing when he was young. He would hop through the ball to make sure he got club thru