As "One Plane" as it gets

[MizunoJoe]

http://www.golfswing.com/proswings/player.htm

Hardy would say one plane, but there is a shift. Notice that at impact, the shaft EXACTLY matches the address plane.

 

[jeffy]

quote:Originally posted by MizunoJoe

http://www.golfswing.com/proswings/player.htm

Hardy would say one plane, but there is a shift. Notice that at impact, the shaft EXACTLY matches the address plane.

Gary Player, I presume?

Hardy has never said the one-plane swing stays on the shaft plane and does not shift to a steeper plane; to the contrary, he actually says it starts on the shaft plane in the takeaway, then the left arm rotates clockwise and lifts the club to the top onto a plane that runs through the shoulders. Most one-planers are double-shift in TGM-ese, which I'm sure Hardy would acknowledge without hesitation (assuming someone explained to him what the term means).

One-plane is a label for a swing where, at the top, the left arm and shoulders more or less lie on the same plane, in other words "one-plane". Despite all these posts ragging on Hardy, his labels don't refer to swingplane, address plane or plane shifts.

 

[Brian Manzella]

Ragging?

I gave him a decen treview...

 

[MizunoJoe]

I wasn't on his case either - just pointing out a swing which would clearly meet his definition.

 

[Vaako]

quote:Originally posted by jeffy

... , his labels don't refer to swingplane, address plane or plane shifts.

And this is why you have an endless job, if you want to be an Hardy apologist in TGM forums. You should probably start talking about Hardy One Plane-pattern instead of One Plane-swing. Those two are - in TGM neck of the woods - two totally different animals.


Vaako

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

You will notice in that clip it was a pull-fade...which is the predominate shot pattern of the "hardy one plane swing" because you have to "steepen" the downswing and come over it a bit.

 

[self-mastery]

I love his footwork.

 

[mandrin]

quote:Originally posted by MizunoJoe

Notice that at impact, the shaft EXACTLY matches the address plane.

Not EXACTLY, there is some bending due to drooping. []


In GP's swing sequence there are some interesting things to observe:

-1- Noticeable drooping of the shaft at impact
-2- The impact frame and next one, beyond impact, show no rolling of the arms.
-3- The first frame beyond impact shows still a substantiallly bent right wrist.

As for a true one-plane swing, have a look here . There are two parallel axes - spine and wrist axis. For such a swing one needs to bend a bit more forward to obtain adequate height for the clubhead in the backswing.

 

[jeffy]

quote:Originally posted by mandrin

quote:Originally posted by MizunoJoe

Notice that at impact, the shaft EXACTLY matches the address plane.

Not EXACTLY, there is some bending due to drooping. []


In GP's swing sequence there are some interesting things to observe:

-1- Noticeable drooping of the shaft at impact
-2- The impact frame and next one, beyond impact, show no rolling of the arms.
-3- The first frame beyond impact shows still a substantiallly bent right wrist.

As for a true one-plane swing, have a look here . There are two parallel axes - spine and wrist axis. For such a swing one needs to bend a bit more forward to obtain adequate height for the clubhead in the backswing.

Player was so flat, wide and shallow, he was constantly fighting a hook, hence the blocked arms. It wasn't until he opened the face at the top and "walked through" that he tamed it.

Player is a true "Hardy one-plane swing". What you illustrate is someone swinging on the shaft plane, good for punch shots I guess. Hardy expressly contemplates a shift up to a swingplane through the shoulders.

 

[mandrin]

quote:Originally posted by jeffy

Player is a true "Hardy one-plane swing". What you illustrate is someone swinging on the shaft plane, good for punch shots I guess. Hardy expressly contemplates a shift up to a swingplane through the shoulders.

Jeffy, there are many haphazard uses of terms and ideas in golf literature. The untidy use of the concept of planes is a good example. What is actually simpler than a plane and yet everlasting discussions about it.

My illustration was primarily meant to give an precise idea of a true one-plane swing. It can’t be used for a full power swing and than one has to rise above the shaft plane. The approximation used by many is than to assume, for a normal standard swing, a second plane, having a steeper slant angle.

I don’t have Hardy’s book but if I am guessing right that he is associating the concept of plane with the left-arm and shoulder-line being parallel at the top, he is using the concept of planes in a confusing non-standard fashion. Actually, this is quite like Hogan’s ideas.

Indeed, the confusion actually started with Hogan himself with his famous glass plane running from the ball to the shoulders. With his plane the arms and club should remain below this plane during the back swing. Similarly for the down swing using a slightly shifted plane.

I feel that the standard logic way of using planes should be to indicate the one(s) on which the shaft is moving through space. This is not the case for Hogan’s glass plane. Yet he uses phrases such as “the golfer gets on the downswing plane” or “remains on his plane” suggesting for a casual reader there being something on a plane which isn’t the case.