Ball Speed Magic Number for "big boy" golf

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Brian Manzella

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If you have a Ball Speed of 160mph or more, you can play any golf course in the country.

Mine is in the 150-155 range at best these days, but that is up slightly recently.

My goal is to get a few in 160 range this year.

On tour that is the speed of middle of the pack, to slightly back of middle golfer ball speed wise.


For example 107 mph with a 1.5 smash factor = 160.5 mph ball speed.


Smash factor is a multiplier.


To get the smash factor up, you need to reduce spin loft, get a good "hot spot on the face" strike, and good equipment.


Oh, and a dynamic swing.
 
hp12c

hp12c

New
Brian Manzella said:
If you have a Ball Speed of 160mph or more, you can play any golf course in the country.

Mine is in the 150-155 range at best these days, but that is up slightly recently.

My goal is to get a few in 160 range this year.

On tour that is the speed of middle of the pack, to slightly back of middle golfer ball speed wise.


For example 107 mph with a 1.5 smash factor = 160.5 mph ball speed.


Smash factor is a multiplier.


To get the smash factor up, you need to reduce spin loft, get a good "hot spot on the face" strike, and good equipment.


Oh, and a dynamic swing.
Click to expand...

Oh man, no big boy golf for me!!! maybe big girlf golf? oh wait nope they kick my butt too, whats left?
 
huestisc

huestisc

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Brian,

How much have you been able to increase clubhead speed with your students via Trackman (in one lesson and/or over time?)

I've been on TM only once and was surprised by how hard it was to move the path and AoA numbers. For instance to move my 6 deg inside out path to even 3 deg required radically different feels in set-up, aim and intent. Similarly I found I was hitting up with the Driver, around 1deg normally but even with the most exaggerated swing I could only move it a couple degrees.

My clubhead speed with the Driver was depressingly low, in the high 80's and the range from 85 on very easy swings to a high of 90 swingingout of my boots. Now that you have a few years of TM verified teaching under your belt I'm very curious to know how much you are able to move these numbers.

Clay
 
A

art

New
huestisc said:
Brian,

How much have you been able to increase clubhead speed with your students via Trackman (in one lesson and/or over time?)

I've been on TM only once and was surprised by how hard it was to move the path and AoA numbers. For instance to move my 6 deg inside out path to even 3 deg required radically different feels in set-up, aim and intent. Similarly I found I was hitting up with the Driver, around 1deg normally but even with the most exaggerated swing I could only move it a couple degrees.

My clubhead speed with the Driver was depressingly low, in the high 80's and the range from 85 on very easy swings to a high of 90 swingingout of my boots. Now that you have a few years of TM verified teaching under your belt I'm very curious to know how much you are able to move these numbers.

Clay
Click to expand...

Clay,
My guess is that Brian’s last point of a ‘dynamic’ swing was short for a ‘dynamically balanced swing’. Experience with the science and recent research associated with dynamic balance and stability of the golf swing simplifies into three major areas of interest; (1) lower body, (2) upper body and (3) shoulder complex. Qualitatively what appears to happen is if, due to the significant forces and torques of the ‘very dynamic’ downswing the bodies balancing systems detect abnormal movements that challenge basic safety and survival and the natural domains of reference built in to each of us by our ‘creator’ or ‘evolver’, undesirable fast twitch reflexes, and other involuntary NON GOLF SWING reactions occur. The quantitatively measured results of these imbalances show up in most of the Trackman parameters, but especially the Smash Factor (Ball velocity divided by Club Head Velocity). What basically happens is that the bodies reactions to dynamic imbalances trigger the previously mentioned reflex actions, but also prematurely fire antagonistic muscles that were waiting to decelerate the body after impact, both significantly REDUCING the club head velocity, AND the centered quality of the impact point on the club face.
While seemingly complicated, I bet you can increase your overall stability margin and associated club head velocity and Smash Factor with one small lower body dynamic stability set-up change. Simply ‘Pre Activate’ the muscle slings and complexes associated with you ‘rear, NOT lead hip, resulting in a few degrees ‘closed’ hip/pelvic position AS YOU COMPLETE YOUR SET-UP. If you use a forward press BE SURE NOT to undo this slightly closed position, HOLD IT, and then just start your normal back swing and watch the Trackman numbers AND the quality of your ball striking improve. Good luck, and please let me know how well this works for you.
 
S

siksta

New
[
If you have a Ball Speed of 160mph or more, you can play any golf course in the country.
Click to expand...


Why is that? Due to the lenght of courses or are you refereing to the avg of ball speed here . Thank You
 
C

cwdlaw223

New
It's sad to see people make wild claims on the internet about their club head speed. I just saw a video with Trackman data showing a smash factor of 1.47 and a ball speed of 129 mph. This person claimed a club head speed of 110 "verified" by swing speed radar. Her real club head speed was 87.7 mph for a driver. Nobody has 22 mph speed in the tank just sitting around (except for some freak long driver maybe).
 
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spmurph

New
art said:
Simply ‘Pre Activate’ the muscle slings and complexes associated with you ‘rear, NOT lead hip, resulting in a few degrees ‘closed’ hip/pelvic position AS YOU COMPLETE YOUR SET-UP. If you use a forward press BE SURE NOT to undo this slightly closed position, HOLD IT, and then just start your normal back swing and watch the Trackman numbers AND the quality of your ball striking improve. Good luck, and please let me know how well this works for you.
Click to expand...

Not Clay but thanks for the advice Art. If it wasn't snowing here I'd head to the range and give this a try today. One question though. Is this preset to be done without moving your feet?

I've always had trouble with a closed setup position when I drop my rear foot and shoulder back. I seem to work under it and hit a block.
 
ZAP

ZAP

New
So all I have to do is find another 3.5 mph of ball speed and I can play big boy golf! Good news!
I hope this means I might have to buy a new driver!
 
B

Bigwill

New
Brian Manzella said:
If you have a Ball Speed of 160mph or more, you can play any golf course in the country.

Mine is in the 150-155 range at best these days, but that is up slightly recently.

My goal is to get a few in 160 range this year.

On tour that is the speed of middle of the pack, to slightly back of middle golfer ball speed wise.


For example 107 mph with a 1.5 smash factor = 160.5 mph ball speed.


Smash factor is a multiplier.


To get the smash factor up, you need to reduce spin loft, get a good "hot spot on the face" strike, and good equipment.


Oh, and a dynamic swing.
Click to expand...

Good to know. Wish I had the skill to take advantage of it...:)
 
A

art

New
spmurph said:
Not Clay but thanks for the advice Art. If it wasn't snowing here I'd head to the range and give this a try today. One question though. Is this preset to be done without moving your feet?

I've always had trouble with a closed setup position when I drop my rear foot and shoulder back. I seem to work under it and hit a block.
Click to expand...

Yes, as a start, just leave both your feet in the same location of your 'normal' set up. You should feel a slightly higher right hip, and slight 'clockwise' torque between your right foot and the ground, and again, be careful not to release this 'right hip back' position if you forward press before starting your back swing.

(Regarding your comment about the position of your right foot, you may want to explore other slight position and flair locations later after seeing how very POWERFUL this first small change works. What you would be seeking is the position that provides you with the maximum dynamic stability margin of your pelvis and lower body).
 
dschultz6072

dschultz6072

New
cwdlaw223 said:
It's sad to see people make wild claims on the internet about their club head speed. I just saw a video with Trackman data showing a smash factor of 1.47 and a ball speed of 129 mph. This person claimed a club head speed of 110 "verified" by swing speed radar. Her real club head speed was 87.7 mph for a driver. Nobody has 22 mph speed in the tank just sitting around (except for some freak long driver maybe).
Click to expand...
It must be my swing style or something because ever since I've been working with my radar at home and swinging left, I've gained quite a bit of yardage. The last time I played I hit every drive at least 270, and one went 290 (Bushnell lasered). Whatever speed that equates to, I don't yet know. But I've been swinging from 107-115 on the radar. Trying to get on TM this week. Last year 97 was swinging out of my ass and hitting it 230 yards was a good shot.
 
A

art

New
dschultz6072 said:
It must be my swing style or something because ever since I've been working with my radar at home and swinging left, I've gained quite a bit of yardage. The last time I played I hit every drive at least 270, and one went 290 (Bushnell lasered). Whatever speed that equates to, I don't yet know. But I've been swinging from 107-115 on the radar. Trying to get on TM this week. Last year 97 was swinging out of my ass and hitting it 230 yards was a good shot.
Click to expand...

Congratulations, and welcome to the world of improved dynamic balance and stability by your own 'trial and error' methods. If you were lucky enough to have recorded your 230, 270 and 290 yard swings on force plates, in addition to a launch monitor, you would have been able to see great improvement in the vertical reaction forces staying well within the area/zone between your feet.

Also the data from the launch monitor should indicate higher 'smash factors' (more centered hits), and probably better (closer to optimum) launch angles and horizontal ball spin rates, ALL enhanced, IMO by better dynamic balance. What changes did you make to your set-up or swing to realize thes increases ??
 
P

ParHunter

New
Art,

do you have some pictures, more detailed description of your suggestions? I struggle to picture the set-up position you proposed with your back hip closed.

Basically what you are saying is that if you have problems with your balance in your swing that that will slow down the swing dramatically because some muscles think they have to catch you from falling is that correct? Stupid muscles, I don't care if I fall over as long as my drive is long and straight ;-)
 
dschultz6072

dschultz6072

New
art said:
Congratulations, and welcome to the world of improved dynamic balance and stability by your own 'trial and error' methods. If you were lucky enough to have recorded your 230, 270 and 290 yard swings on force plates, in addition to a launch monitor, you would have been able to see great improvement in the vertical reaction forces staying well within the area/zone between your feet.

Also the data from the launch monitor should indicate higher 'smash factors' (more centered hits), and probably better (closer to optimum) launch angles and horizontal ball spin rates, ALL enhanced, IMO by better dynamic balance. What changes did you make to your set-up or swing to realize thes increases ??
Click to expand...
Not a whole lot. Swinging left pretty much. A little more dynamic move and turning my shoulders the same way back and through, not getting under it and hitting it cruddy. Pretty much just swinging in front of the sliding glass door at home is 80% of my practice. I am hitting the ball MUCH better now. Very straight, falling to the left. I feel like I can go after it and not be afraid of it going off line. I still get the blocks, but I'm working on it.

Just trying to play from the tips is all.
 
natep

natep

New
art said:
If you were lucky enough to have recorded your 230, 270 and 290 yard swings on force plates, in addition to a launch monitor, you would have been able to see great improvement in the vertical reaction forces staying well within the area/zone between your feet.
Click to expand...

Art, I'm enjoying your posts. I think you mentioned before that the left (lead) hip needs to have a higher velocity than the trail hip on the downswing. I'm wondering how this relates to your comment above about vertical reaction forces remaining between the feet, and how this relates to weight shifting between the right and left foot in the downswing. Thanks.
 
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