Bogey hole help...

[JohnThomas1]

Guys i need some help regarding two holes, which play back to back and are almost single handedly stagnating my handicap.

Both involve very tight OB fences on the right and play into a sizable wind or worse most every time. Both have fairway bunkers on the left and plenty of wooden obstacles further left. Even if i haven't leaked left all day i almost always do on one or both of these holes, sometimes twice on the second one. Quite often if on a good score i aim at the fairway bunks and try to hit a solid fade. Sometimes it works and even if in the bunkers i am not THAT worried. However i can get ahead of the ball i think and the ball starts center or worse and fades right out of damn play.

Are there any practices i might be able to try? The first has a big overhanging branch from the right 50 yards out making it impracticle to go the draw or hook route and the second has a downhill tree lined right side as well, so draws starting on the right side are are out.

 

[pecky987]

knockdown 3-iron
safe, long-ish and consistent

or try playing easy and play it like a par 5 until, you feel confident enough to take it on with longer clubs

 

[JohnThomas1]

knockdown 3-iron
safe, long-ish and consistent

or try playing easy and play it like a par 5 until, you feel confident enough to take it on with longer clubs

You know you're probably right. They both play longish due to the wind and me being average length. The shame is that when i do get my drive away my iron play in is usually good, especially on the one playing index #2. It's happening all too infrequent tho and i might even hit my 4 wood off the tee this weekend, a Wishon 949MC i find pretty easy to hit long and straight.

 

[jonlorio]

Yea, I would try leaving the driver in the bag, as long as you're pretty accurate with the long irons to get it on the green in two (or you're confident enough in your short game to leave yourself a one putt). Leaving driver in the bag is a hard thing for me to do.

 

[starretj]

JT1,
Your problem is not uncommon at all and often you will here pros talking about how a hole or shot just doesn't set up well for them or to their eye. I have had the same problem as you on two tee shots at my "home" coarse, however,I couldn't figure out the problem because to my knowledge there is nothing different about these two holes. After a couple of years of only hitting a good tee ball on these holes about 10% of the time, I talked to my local pro about doing an on coarse lesson on the two tee shots. If you can talk your pro into doing this on a slow day, just go to these holes and hit tee balls. I didn't work on mechanics at all, I just made sure my set up was correct and my alignment and started hitting tee shots and discussing with my pro. I have since done this on a couple of other holes, on different shots. One of these was a second and third shot on a par five. Just thought I would add my experience and something I tried that helped. Good luck.

Jim S.

 

[birdie_man]

I'm with you pecky.

Play whatever shot/club you feel basically guarantees you won't hit it into trouble off the tee. Work on your short game so you can get up and down once you're up around/on the green.....

.....(perhaps) until you improve your driving and/or figure out a way to completely and confidently take one side out of play.

(maybe we can help with that?)

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

What are the lengths of these holes and please list how far you hit your driver into the wind when you "hit it good."

Thanks

 

[Rob Ron]

They sound like holes you have lost confidence in. I like the idea of finding a club, shot and target that you have the most confidence in. I have also found it helpful on similar holes to be aware of the tee box and make sure its not directing you in the wrong direction and or to look at the tee shot from various angles on the tee box, Sometimes I can find an angle on a tee box that makes the hole feel entirely easier. Lastly, as others have suggested you could just look at it as a par 4.5 so that if you make a 4 it feels like a birdie and a 5 wouldn't be something to kill your round.

 

[JohnThomas1]

Thanks immensely for the feedback already guys, loving it.

starretj - great insight into visuals and i can well understand your choice of an on course lesson.

Rob Ron - confidence is lacking a bit on these two tee's, even tho at times i do crack a good one. Very seldom on both back to back however, if one doesn't get me the other likely will. 4.5 would be a fine average for me on these, i'd be most happy to play the pair on average in one over. Even bogey, bogey is survivable at the moment.

 

[JohnThomas1]

What are the lengths of these holes and please list how far you hit your driver into the wind when you "hit it good."

Thanks

Jim, the first (14) plays uphill and by imperial is about 353 yards but obviously plays longer due the the incline, let alone the wind. I am 13 handicap and a decent drive into a usual wind on the hole leaves me at about the 135 - 140 yard mark.

15 plays at 367 to a slightly lower level fairway from an elevated tee, with the hole then having a slight incline to the green. Good drives into the wind would again leave me around 135 - 140. A corker on either and obviously i am closer, but my swings not exactly syrupy on these two at present lol. I am not long at all and am often hitting a 7 iron into the said wind to the green off good drives, but good drives are becoming rare on these. Even some of our single figure handicaps can be seen hitting miles left into the trees on these holes. I played with a 17yo (off about 1 or 2 and holds the course record of 64 last year) a while back who is heading for the tour eventually and he was going OB on 14 before the trees saved him by inches and pulled it clean onto the next fairway off the next tee so i'm certainly not the only one wary. It's dare i say a little refreshing to see golfers much better than myself getting the shakes on these.

 

[birdie_man]

There's actually a stretch of 2 holes at my home course that play pretty similar. You gotta hit it real straight...hit something super safe.....or aim at the left treeline basically.....then work it back a little. (open the stance...open the face at address...swing left enough for glancing blow to make it curve) That last play is pretty intimidating too.....cause a straight or double-crossed driver may be going 100 yards in the bush lol.

Sometimes on one of the 2 holes I'll even just go over the trees to the other fairway cause it's open over there. (you can just blast away then come back over the trees again with a little sand wedge)

Anyway.....it's a tough couple holes no matter who you are I think. Simply not comfortable driving holes. (forces you to think twice about playin a risky shot)

 

[self-mastery]

There's a drivable par 4 (320 yd) that doesn't fit my eye. I have never played that hole well. The tee is situated in such an awkward way that I can't properly align myself. I've had to hit a big cut with the driver or a big hook with a hybrid just to get the ball in play. My new plan is just to chop the length in half with a short iron and hit the GIR and drop a putt for birdie.

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Jim, the first (14) plays uphill and by imperial is about 353 yards but obviously plays longer due the the incline, let alone the wind. I am 13 handicap and a decent drive into a usual wind on the hole leaves me at about the 135 - 140 yard mark.

15 plays at 367 to a slightly lower level fairway from an elevated tee, with the hole then having a slight incline to the green. Good drives into the wind would again leave me around 135 - 140. A corker on either and obviously i am closer, but my swings not exactly syrupy on these two at present lol. I am not long at all and am often hitting a 7 iron into the said wind to the green off good drives, but good drives are becoming rare on these. Even some of our single figure handicaps can be seen hitting miles left into the trees on these holes. I played with a 17yo (off about 1 or 2 and holds the course record of 64 last year) a while back who is heading for the tour eventually and he was going OB on 14 before the trees saved him by inches and pulled it clean onto the next fairway off the next tee so i'm certainly not the only one wary. It's dare i say a little refreshing to see golfers much better than myself getting the shakes on these.

For this course, try carrying a strong 3 wood and build it to 43". Something around a 12.5-13* of loft and 42.5-43" in length with a similar weight shaft as your driver. What you need, for these holes, is what clubmakers call "thrivers" (comes from three wood and driver). The slightly higher loft will allow the ball to have more backspin which will encourage both a straighter flight and/or less curvature than your driver however you might only be roughly 10-20 (20 at most) yards behind your normal drive however you should much more accurate with it.

This will obviously force you to hit a 6 iron or an easy 5, but that would be my route for success for you. Sometimes you need purpose built equiptment for certain courses. For instance on 1 tight treeline course i play my normal driver stays home and i carry a 44" 10.5* driver verse my 45" 9.5* driver to only be slightly shorter but much more confident.

Go to the store and find a strong 3 wood in the used club bin, find a deal and try it out. Will probably be your best bet. Teeing off with a 3 iron or anything lower than a 3 wood imo at your length for these holes would make you hit too much of a long iron in imo.

HOpe that helps

 

[pecky987]

For this course, try carrying a strong 3 wood and build it to 43". Something around a 12.5-13* of loft and 42.5-43" in length with a similar weight shaft as your driver. What you need, for these holes, is what clubmakers call "thrivers" (comes from three wood and driver). The slightly higher loft will allow the ball to have more backspin which will encourage both a straighter flight and/or less curvature than your driver however you might only be roughly 10-20 (20 at most) yards behind your normal drive however you should much more accurate with it.

This will obviously force you to hit a 6 iron or an easy 5, but that would be my route for success for you. Sometimes you need purpose built equiptment for certain courses. For instance on 1 tight treeline course i play my normal driver stays home and i carry a 44" 10.5* driver verse my 45" 9.5* driver to only be slightly shorter but much more confident.

Go to the store and find a strong 3 wood in the used club bin, find a deal and try it out. Will probably be your best bet. Teeing off with a 3 iron or anything lower than a 3 wood imo at your length for these holes would make you hit too much of a long iron in imo.

HOpe that helps

well thats why i said he could play it as a par 5 for a while, then as he got more confident, use woods and then the driver.

just clearing things up Jim

 

[JohnThomas1]

For this course, try carrying a strong 3 wood and build it to 43". Something around a 12.5-13* of loft and 42.5-43" in length with a similar weight shaft as your driver. What you need, for these holes, is what clubmakers call "thrivers" (comes from three wood and driver). The slightly higher loft will allow the ball to have more backspin which will encourage both a straighter flight and/or less curvature than your driver however you might only be roughly 10-20 (20 at most) yards behind your normal drive however you should much more accurate with it.

This will obviously force you to hit a 6 iron or an easy 5, but that would be my route for success for you. Sometimes you need purpose built equiptment for certain courses. For instance on 1 tight treeline course i play my normal driver stays home and i carry a 44" 10.5* driver verse my 45" 9.5* driver to only be slightly shorter but much more confident.

Go to the store and find a strong 3 wood in the used club bin, find a deal and try it out. Will probably be your best bet. Teeing off with a 3 iron or anything lower than a 3 wood imo at your length for these holes would make you hit too much of a long iron in imo.

HOpe that helps

Thanks Jim! I've actually not long taken possession of a CB2 15* that i am going to put a firmer shaft in. It is 43 long and i hit if quite low and most people will agree this model is monster long. I have an Accra T70 driver pull here in X flex that i am going to put straight in and butt cut to length to form what should be a S flex in the 3 wood. This club will be the ticket i think and i totally agree i can't afford to be too far back - no further than a full 5 iron i reckon. Anything longer in and the fence could still be in play on the second shot. My back up driver (V1 TP Burner) is actually getting reshafted tomorrow with a 757 - if my driving is not running white hot coming into these holes on the weekend i will go to my longest FW and see how things pan out. Thanks again.

 

[JohnThomas1]

Tho the topic has been resolved i have found pics (not great but give the general sense) of both these holes.

Here is 14

http://www.golfinpictures.com.au/yeppoon2/target1.html

It is steeper uphill than it seems and almost always into a strong wind. Fairway bunker can barely be made out on the left. The row of trees all the way thru the hole on the right are on the out of bounds stakes. The fairway bunkers on left are at the 150 yard mark about. You can see the overhanging tree which caught my best power draw one day LOL. Our resident 1 handicapper and many other top players smash fades aimed roughly at the highest trees on the left not far from the green, aiming to find the fairway on the left side or middle.

15 is here

http://www.golfinpictures.com.au/yeppoon2/target5.html

it's actually more elevated than it appears here. The row of trees on the right are OB and the green is actually behind the biggest tree straight across from the yellow house. Drives just inside the bunker line will find you needing a draw to find the green with OB on the right still well in play. Top players again seem to hammer fades at the highest tree on the left. This would be the most dangerous drive on the course IMO. A while back i saw our resident 1 capper, with a rare tailwind, hit a drive that ended just past the far tree base on the left leaving him a little flop wedge out of rough to the green.