Cool 3D Wrist Data of a multiple PGA tour winner

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Brian Manzella

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The teacher of a multiple winner and current player on the PGA Tour was nice enough to send me this data.

No discussion of, guessing out loud, or any such thing about who this might be. Posts will be deleted. Data like this is very hard to come by of current players.

Since we discuss the forces and torques that I teach as per our great friend Dr. Nesbit, I though it would be instructive and cool to have the 3d of an actual star golfer who is an exceptional ball striker's trail and lead wrists 3D.

Enjoy!
 

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lia41985

lia41985

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Would it be possible that in addition to graphs we were able to see still images or other footage relating these forces and torques to movements we see in a high-level golf swing?

Brian,
You did a great job of that when discussing alpha, beta, and gamma with the Rory sequence. If you have the time, great. I'm grateful for whatever you can offer. Thanks.

A little analysis along with the presentation of data could go a long way.
 
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bluebird

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It looks like the spank he puts on the ball is not at it's peak at impact, but more in the middle of the curve. Is there a way to interpret where the clubhead is at the graph's peaking average?
 
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lia41985

lia41985

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The question? Probably several good ones, no?

Of course you seem to have an idea about how club selection plays into this, right? That's why it's the question, no?
 
mjstrong

mjstrong

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Sure looks like "free-wheeling" through impact, doesn't it?

It would be fascinating to see the differences in this chart (or most of the other ones posted on this site, TBH) through the bag. Great stuff guys!
 
lia41985

lia41985

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Question: can we be more "trusting" of these anatomical measurements than we can of derived measurements (velocity, acceleration, etc.)? I believe so although, again, we can probe deeper.

For instance, if we want to know what the hips are doing it may be better to measure each hip (just as each wrist was measured in the above example) than just to measure the pelvis--that's if you want to know what the hips are doing. That kinda seems obvious but complexity tends to obscure and we may sometimes too quickly embrace simplicity.
 
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niblick1

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Trying to think about the wrist relationships makes my head hurt, but the striking thing is the lead arm rotation is all negative until "pour it on time" and all happens in a few tenths of a second. Someone laying it off in transition (not tumbling?) then with a ton of rotation. No double move here...a swing Shields would like (ok, I won't try to guess who...).

Makes me think driver....?
 
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Dariusz J.

Dariusz J.

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Publishing these data without knowing who it is (or better said, what kind of release the man has) as well as what club was hit is pointless.
OTOH, I'd really want to see such data of players with difficult release types.
Having said it, I appreciate that someone dealt with such a subject. Kudos.

Cheers
 
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Brian Manzella

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Never going to tell anyone the name of the golfer.

Will post some stills of the avatar.

Elbow planer, pretty open body at impact is a start.
 
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Brian Manzella

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Besides it is a private 3D file here is another reason:

We are looking for commonalities in the best golfers. We don't have a method.

I understand and applaud the Stack & Tilters for showing golfers doing the "Stack & Tilt swing" with force plates, AMM 6dof 3D, and TrackMan.

I might do that for a famous golfer, my student or not, if we had all the data.

But, there is no "Manzella swing."

Toms, Gahm, Shields, Franklin, Merrill, Guilbeau, Lyons, Leary, Sanders, etc. etc....all swing differently.

I've worked a lot with all the other USA Manzella Instructors swings and they all look different as well.
 
lia41985

lia41985

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So you want the fundamentals (i.e commonalities) without the fundamentalism (i.e. association with a method). Good luck threading that needle...

Just giving you a little needle :)
 
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Brian Manzella

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lia41985 said:
So you want the fundamentals (i.e commonalities) without the fundamentalism (i.e. association with a method). Good luck threading that needle...
Click to expand...

I already do that.

The only change is the constant upgrading of, and additions to, what we know to be truly important......and not very.
 
lia41985

lia41985

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Dariusz J. said:
Publishing these data without knowing who it is (or better said, what kind of release the man has) as well as what club was hit is pointless.
OTOH, I'd really want to see such data of players with difficult release types.
Having said it, I appreciate that someone dealt with such a subject. Kudos.

Cheers
Click to expand...
Hey Dariusz,

Somewhere along the way I wronged you terribly. I am so sorry for it. Also, wanted to just say how much I respect your comment. I think the player's identity is an important factor in how the data should be processed and from that what lessons will be taught. Because we're all unique and assemble components in our own way (more than just grip, stance, etc.) we will also move our bodies in different ways. And this isn't a one way flow of influence. No doubt Ben Hogan possessed certain inherent physical/athletic attributes that allowed him to use his body during the swing as he did. Sinewy comes to mind. I wonder if we had a sample of his fascia what it would have revealed :)

Basically, people, we are dealing with Spiderman. And he's good with clubs, too.

Again, sorry. I really thought that most of the time I was just teasing you a little and it'd be obvious...no doubt I went overboard at least once. So sorry.
 
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