Couples and Watson (and how far left is Couples aiming?)

[niblick1]

The Champions Tour weekend rounds were great fun to watch, primarily because Watson and Couples were both playing very well (nice scenery, too). I DVR'd Sunday's round and watched it during the commercials and halftime of the Saints game. It was a fun duel to watch.

I liked the video of Watson 30 years ago vs. today (very little change in the swing). The way Watson drives the ball the last several years you are surprised when he misses a fairway.

Couples motion is just a pleasure to watch. I never get tired of seeing him hit the ball.

I know camera angles can be deceiving, but it looks like Couples lines up 30-50 yards left of target. And in watching Bubba Watson some this weekend, it looks at times like he is lining up 40-60 yards right of target. Is there something about their swings that causes them to line-up even more left (and in lefty Bubba Watson's, more right) than is typical to compensate for d-plane/ballflight? I know Bubba moves the ball a lot left/right.

 

[softconsult]

Couples has always done that, but can't attest to how much may be due to camera angle. How about the shoes? Sort of a crepe nubbed sole with no spikes. Maybe the same model that Ryan Moore has been wearing.

I hit some balls yesterday and enlisted the help of friend to tell me my shoulder line / heel line. Sure enough, heel line fine and shoulders closed. Had to feel like open shoulders to actually be parallel left. We just can't see ourselves.

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Couples likes to play the fade so you have to aim a whole lot left to get it to fade to the target

 

[gmbtempe]

Couples likes to play the fade so you have to aim a whole lot left to get it to fade to the target

Is this comment specific to Couples swing. Is he aiming his body left of the ball target line?

Hogan played the long irons with a square stance to the ball target line, did he fade those type of shots?

I thought that as long as you could get the face open just a slight bit more than your path then it would fade (a fade, not a cut), why the need to aim that far left?

 

[Steve Khatib]

Because you need the path way left and the face open with the ball curving away from the face.

The opposite to Matt Kuchar(gee how was his action today).

 

[spktho]

Because you need the path way left and the face open with the ball curving away from the face.

Wouldn't swinging left with an open clubface produce more of a slice(depending on how open the clubface)? Opposed to a square clubface and swinging left will produce more of a slight fade(depending on how far left the path)? I'm still trying to get a handle on the D-plane.

 

[Steve Khatib]

This all depends on the VSP(vertical swing plane) or how much you hit down on the ball etc.

Sure how open the face is will change fade to slice etc etc

 

[spktho]

This all depends on the VSP(vertical swing plane) or how much you hit down on the ball etc.

Sure how open the face is will change fade to slice etc etc

Thanks. And the more down you hit, the more right the ball starts? I may be getting it now.

 

[Steve Khatib]

Thanks. And the more down you hit, the more right the ball starts? I may be getting it now.

Yes, you got it- Spk.

 

[Kevin Shields]

If you get the chance to watch Couples hit balls up close, do it. Not only is it awesome viewing, nothing can really describe how far left that guy aims. Its unreal. And another thing, ive seen him hit balls a bunch and he almost never hits a fade. I think it changes on the course for whatever reason.

 

[GPM1985]

And another thing, ive seen him hit balls a bunch and he almost never hits a fade. I think it changes on the course for whatever reason.

That's odd. What does he hit on the range? If you had to guess, why do you think he starts to fade the ball when he gets on the course?

 

[dbl]

I suggest watching the TGC's Playing Lesson with the Pros for Freddie's own input. He aims way left and then hits a straight push, with slight varations for draw or fade.

 

[Kevin Shields]

That's odd. What does he hit on the range? If you had to guess, why do you think he starts to fade the ball when he gets on the course?

He hits a little draw. Ive seen it a dozen times. I think when he's just super relaxed on the range he has that little release at the bottom. The out left arm and uncocked left wrist and toss release spells draw. Maybe he gets the handle going faster or something on the course or just trusts the fade more. Ill bet he's have an interesting answer.

 

[Kevin Shields]

I suggest watching the TGC's Playing Lesson with the Pros for Freddie's own input. He aims way left and then hits a straight push, with slight varations for draw or fade.

When i asked him he said he just releases earlier for a draw and later for a fade, no more thought than that. "Anything with the clubface, Fred?" "Nah"

 

[spktho]

If you get the chance to watch Couples hit balls up close, do it. Not only is it awesome viewing, nothing can really describe how far left that guy aims. Its unreal. And another thing, ive seen him hit balls a bunch and he almost never hits a fade. I think it changes on the course for whatever reason.

I saw him at a Hope Classic about 10-15 years ago. His swing looks so loose, but amazing how much club head acceleration he has from what looks like half way down in the downswing to impact. He has/had some thick thighs too. The only draw he hit was after his tee shot went right of that fairway bunker on 18 and his ball was waist high with his stance in the bunker. Needless to say he hit what looked like a 4 iron that started right edge of the green and hooked into the water.

 

[w.g.canon]

Face angle, path, attack, etc.

Is it possible to make any assumptions regarding Mr. Couples’ impact numbers after viewing the following video?

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZa8sbXlyT8[/media].

I am referring specifically to the initial tee ball at the outset of the clip. It appears to my eye to be a reasonably “straight” flight. What kind of numbers would allow this from his set up if we assume he is aligned 6* or 30 yards left of his ultimate target? I recognize it is imperative to know what his angle of attack is but can we calculate a few possible permutations based on prior understanding of his swing? Does any member know whether his tendency is to swing up, down or level?

I am experiencing some difficulty determining what is truly going on at impact and I would prefer to know rather than to suspect. Any intuitive and educated responses would be appreciated. Cheers, William

 

[dbl]

When i asked him he said he just releases earlier for a draw and later for a fade, no more thought than that. "Anything with the clubface, Fred?" "Nah"

Neat. Plus there's the bit from a Rotella book where BR asks FC what he thinks about to hit a certain shot, and FC says he just remembers back to the best shot like that that he's ever hit....and then...lets his brain make his body do the same thing again.

 

[gmbtempe]

When i asked him he said he just releases earlier for a draw and later for a fade, no more thought than that. "Anything with the clubface, Fred?" "Nah"

Who is his teacher, AJ Bonar?