Defining "Golf Science" & Selling Ice to Eskimos

[wulsy]

Bizarre as it may seem, I agree with both Frans and DC's last posts almost completely!

There are (FACT) guys out there with a full lesson book who are USELESS as golf teachers. These guys are invariably akin to successful salesmen OR have some kind of USP (eg did their training at a world class resort) which allows them to convince the naive of their credibility. But equally there are no doubt clueless clowns who only manage 5 lessons a week BECAUSE they are useless.

There are guys out there who have a full lesson book because they are sheet hot golf teachers. I would guess DC is one of them. But equally there are surely sheet hot teachers who are not fully booked.

There are also cyber experts and clubhouse experts who think they know it all but couldn't teach to save themselves in the real world of the golf range with a paying customer in front of them.

Conclusion: the golfing public is so diverse that there is at least more than one way to acquire and keep customers/pupils.

 

[DCgolf]

I do not take this as a personal attack and even if I did it would be irrelevant; the point is this: Brian Manzella and his team of researchers are providing a great service to the world of golf instruction; that's why im here and why i joined the other site. But his research has credibility because he uses it in the field. The practical application of the science is what I'm addressing. As I said in my original post, taking science to the lesson tee is like a good player taking a new move to the golf course. Much of this stuff (eg D Plane) is very practical and can be used day in day out. On the other hand, for example, SCIENCE says that 75% of the initial flight of the golf ball is a result of the clubface. And I suppose it's been proven. But, honestly, that research, flies in the face of what I SEE day in and day out. And I correct swings based on what i see, not read. If the ball behaves better, I've done my job; if not I have to try another way. That's how I have conducted some 30,000 golf lessons, and the only way I find practical to continue doing so. Hogan said the answer is in the dirt; so is teaching!

Nice guys can get lessons for a while; but the golfing public is not nearly as gullible as is being presented. I charge double what some instructors at my facility and in the area charge. And I ain't a nice guy. I don't blow smoke at these people. Over the long haul, they are here to get better, not be complemented! These BSers are here today, gone tomorrow, and/or they are usually getting a salary from their club. Yes this is my personal experience, but Im also relating what I have seen for years. Find me one "nice guy" who is teaching BS, and gets NO free supply of lessons and no other compensation from the club who lasts at that job very long. I charge a lot and get no first refusal from members, hotel guests or day guests. But Ive got more work that I can handle.

Honestly I was more of a fan of this site when it was about fixing golf swings; ala case studies. And I get it, I really do think Brian is the real deal because I know BS when I see it, and this ain't it; Thx Frans, I enjoy the debate. In fact thx to all who contribute on this site; I really enjoy it.

 

[Brian Manzella]

Depending on the country ALL independent PGA instructors have no help at all from the facility in order to get a full book. Because if he does get help then in accordance to the tax laws he is not longer independent.

Not in the US.

LOTS of teachers PAY OFF the folks that answer to phones—one way or the other.

But again you did not reply to the real response which was the financial success has no relation at all how good a teacher someone is. It only explains that he was successful in selling his services. Noting more, noting less.

I guarantees VERY LITTLE, I'll give you that.

But 100% of the teachers I respect—100%—started out with ZERO BOOK and no place to get it except through good teaching of some degree.

There is a market for good coaches and there is a market for bad coaches - the qualities of those suppliers which affects their financial success goes far beyond the ability to teach.

I said PRE-requisite. Not proof.

If you've never done it, you might be teaching anything.

Brian Manzella stood countless hours on the lesson tee doing yeomen's work before he began his scientific investigations. In fact that's how he knew to go looking for deeper truths.

That should be tattooed on this and every site I am a part of.

The point I'm making is the cyber golf world is loaded with scientific minded folks who have never stood behind anyone on the lesson tee.

Almost ALL of the trouble on the internet are caused by folks who have a teaching resume you can print on a postage stamp.