Does Swing plane matter anymore?
- Thread starter Tball88
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Richie3Jack
New
'True Path' determines flight. AoA and the horizontal plane determine the 'true path.'
3JACK
Matt Bryda
New
imo Over the top= arms/hands/club swinging left without lower body support, ie. hips backing up as a result of no axis tilt or not enough axis tilt bending the Horizontal swing plane so far left and steep that the shot is lost.
Brian Manzella
Administrator
ggsjpc
New
AoA and VSP and HSP
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Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
Not immediately, but yes you learn to "feel" it and you just work on it. However i have found that most people tend to drift towards fade or draw patterns based on their natural path. So once i do my best to neutral them out and they can do it and do it farily well. I move them slightly towards the fade or the draw they want to hit.
To me, what Jim is saying is what is so great about the D-Plane.
I have a natural draw path, I'm short, swing on a flatter plane, and just feel more comfortable swinging just a bit to the right. I'm not tremendously off, but I definitely swing a bit right.
Instead of forcing myself to try to learn a perfect path, with my better understanding of D-Plane, I'm working on finding a way to get my club face just a bit more open at impact, whether that be through a weaker grip, or opening up the face slightly at setup.
I have a natural draw path, I'm short, swing on a flatter plane, and just feel more comfortable swinging just a bit to the right. I'm not tremendously off, but I definitely swing a bit right.
Instead of forcing myself to try to learn a perfect path, with my better understanding of D-Plane, I'm working on finding a way to get my club face just a bit more open at impact, whether that be through a weaker grip, or opening up the face slightly at setup.
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
That only works if you aren't swinging too far to the right.
BTW it's easier to take someone like you and make their path a BUNCH more left and then ease you back to slightly right.
Just sayn'
Jimbo Skelton
New
Ok had a read through this post & it's going off down a few roads. I believe the original question wS does plane matter anymore? Well I think Jim said in an earlier post yes, I'm with him of course it matters! Now are we talking horizontal plane Line/plane line/ direction of swing? Or plane angle?
People are talking about controling the face rather than the path, wel sure if you had awesome face control you could hav a true path of 20* inside out & if you could get the face 10* open everytime you finish on target but your in a whole world of pain trying to be consistNt with that extreme path. Now I belive that the most servere path on your is kenny perry who is about 8* inside out.
At the end of the day if you wana hit the ball straight you gota have a path that's somewhere near 0, I guess my point is yes plane is still important
People are talking about controling the face rather than the path, wel sure if you had awesome face control you could hav a true path of 20* inside out & if you could get the face 10* open everytime you finish on target but your in a whole world of pain trying to be consistNt with that extreme path. Now I belive that the most servere path on your is kenny perry who is about 8* inside out.
At the end of the day if you wana hit the ball straight you gota have a path that's somewhere near 0, I guess my point is yes plane is still important
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Ill be doing a very interesting (hopefully) plane angle experiment in the next few days.
ggsjpc
New
Kevin,
What was the experiment and how did it come out? If secret KSRAD then I hope it was fruitful.
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Eh, it didnt turn up the exciting results that I thought it might. I hit some drivers off my knees and they all flew straight. On video at impact the shaft angle was barely 15 degrees or so but came up at 30 degree VSW on trackman. I was hoping to get it up higher than that to really show that shaft plane angle wasnt really that important.
And obviously the ball flew straight from severe heel contact. Sorts proved my point but wasnt that exciting enough to post. Ive seen some very vertical looking 6 irons that come up 55 and some orthodox ones that come up 66. Sweetspot vector is alot different than shaft plane angle.
And obviously the ball flew straight from severe heel contact. Sorts proved my point but wasnt that exciting enough to post. Ive seen some very vertical looking 6 irons that come up 55 and some orthodox ones that come up 66. Sweetspot vector is alot different than shaft plane angle.
ggsjpc
New
I think it is very interesting. Now if I thing about bulge and roll and then lay the shaft on the ground, the roll becomes the bulge and vise versa.
So, I guess that would be an above center hit.
Also if you forward lean the shaft you actually open the face.
Were the numbers all hook numbers that flew straight?
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
They were severe hook numbers and all the balls flew very sraight to a little fade. The forward lean at that plane angle actually just squared the face.
Damon Lucas
Super Moderator
Kevin,
Can you give some examples(numbers) whereby hook(or fade) numbers are skewed the other way by out of sweetspot contact?
Cheers,
Damon
Can you give some examples(numbers) whereby hook(or fade) numbers are skewed the other way by out of sweetspot contact?
Cheers,
Damon
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
Actually a great example would be Justin Rose whose numbers for a 6 iron (if I remember correctly) were something like 3 or 4 dgrees positive (in to out) swing path and 1 degree open (closed to path) face. This should have resulted in a ball that started out to the right slightly and had a noticeable draw. However, his spin axis was positive (fade). He hits in to out closed face, heel fades.
ggsjpc
New
Thank you for correcting me. I should have been more clear.
wow. that's interesting!
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