faldo just said that rory's hips are turning 716 degrees per second......

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Michael Finney

Michael Finney

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he didn't mention at what part of the downswing, however.....i don't remember numbers like that ever being mentioned on a golf telecast before
 
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Damon Lucas

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Actually, they are very realistic numbers in the middle of the downswing. His hips probably close about 60 degrees in about 1/12 of a second(.05 of a second), which is about 1/5 of the usual time it takes to make a downswing(top to impact). Usual numbers for a pro are about 500 degrees per second, and good amateurs are about 400 - 450 degrees per sec.
 
magicmarker

magicmarker

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It's a poor job of getting their point across, whatever that point was.

How fast do they stop in order to hold a balanced finish?
 
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Mike O

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So much for head still

I was taught by a teacher that promoted moving your head. Never been a big advocate of head still. But with "one of the best swings on tour" - so much for head still. Curious they haven't gone after him as people go after Tiger with "the head bobbing" issue. I'm sure if he doesn't win or goes on a dry spell - sooner or later someone will write to the fact that his head bobs and that is why he is inconsistent - which would be a mistake.
 
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art

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Michael Finney said:
he didn't mention at what part of the downswing, however.....i don't remember numbers like that ever being mentioned on a golf telecast before
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Dear Mike,

To my knowledge, the first disclosure of Rory McIlroy's incredible hip rotational velocities, both positive and negative appeared in the December 2011 edition of Golf Magazine on pages 76 and 77. I immediately responded to Dave Phillips the author asking him to update and correct the article, but missed the opportunity on the bottom of page 77 to also ask him to correct the name of Brian Mogg to Brian Manzella, unless there is something I don't yet understand about stage names.

Regarding the article, and the responses to this thread, I quickly want to add CAUTION to anyone thinking that increased hip rotational velocity like this is the way to go. From the medical research I have reviewed from the Centinela Biomechanical Labs, and the more recent tests in process at The Cleveland Clinic regarding lower back injury, IMO, increased hip speed may be the largest contributor to injury, and the smallest contributor to golfers performance in both distance and accuracy.

Back to Rory's swing, the reason for the 'reversal' in angular velocity of his hips is the incredible increase in angular velocity of his torso most probably from the torque generating capability of his abdominal, and IMO spine motor muscles/characteristics. The quantitative scientific evidence can be 'seen' by looking at the 'difference' in angular velocity between the torso and the hips during the down swing. In mathematical and physics terms, the 'slope' of the difference of these curves versus the time over which these changes took place, IS the angular acceleration, or angular deceleration. So then the torque creating the motions between these two elements, the torso and the hips, can be calculated as the product of the 'moment of inertia' of the torso, times the angular acceleration of interest, both positive or negative.

My estimates from just the curves in the Golf Magazine article clearly indicate that Rory's torso strength and rotation DOMINATES his hips/legs, to the degree that they actually CHANGE DIRECTION after impact, and then from the overall momentum of his upper body, resume the counterclockwise rotation during follow thru. PLEASE DO NOT TRY TO DO THIS.

Regards,
art
 
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art

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Brian Manzella said:
Yeah, but free spinning ain't a good idea either, right Art?
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Dear Brian,

For sure, spinning, or as I like to call it "flying in formation" will severely LIMIT the angular velocity of the primary rotating body elements of the golf swing, the hips, the torso and the shoulder complexes and arms.

While the science is not yet complete, IMO the peak LEAD ARM angular velocity is the most influencing contributor to accurate and repeatable club head velocity, as this characteristics precedes the crucial release process presently receiving a great deal of necessary effort, discussion and understanding. The release being the benefactor of the rotational energy in the arms and the wrists which provide the transfer of some of this energy into the club, even adding varying amounts of their own through alpha, beta and gamma torques.

So, somewhere between Rory McIlroy's maximum hip velocity of 719 degrees per second, and the 400 or so for the rest of us amateurs, lies a unique NON SPINNING maximum arm rotational velocity and release that consistently produces shots that meet our expectations.

Best regards, and continued prayers until the sun shines,
art
 
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Mike O

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art said:
Back to Rory's swing, the reason for the 'reversal' in angular velocity of his hips is the incredible increase in angular velocity of his torso most probably from the torque generating capability of his abdominal, and IMO spine motor muscles/characteristics. The quantitative scientific evidence can be 'seen' by looking at the 'difference' in angular velocity between the torso and the hips during the down swing. In mathematical and physics terms, the 'slope' of the difference of these curves versus the time over which these changes took place, IS the angular acceleration, or angular deceleration. So then the torque creating the motions between these two elements, the torso and the hips, can be calculated as the product of the 'moment of inertia' of the torso, times the angular acceleration of interest, both positive or negative.
Regards,
art
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Art,
He's into the follow through when the hip stall shows up. My personal guess would be that it's an impact force wave flowing through his body - and given the particular stabilization or lack there of - it shows up in his hips into the follow-thru. Just a guess - no scientific support for it.
 
BrendanC

BrendanC

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Nick Faldo's Golf Swing 1994 - YouTube

I think Faldo's hips slow as the clubhead gets to the bottom of the swing.

They seem to here in Martin Kaymer's swing as well for example:

MARTIN KAYMER SLOW MOTION 6TH FAIRWAY DUBAI DESERT CLASSIC.wmv - YouTube

Even this (warning: Hogan footage!) Ben Hogan Driver FO pre1 - YouTube

The question is this: does the left hip come close to a complete stop as the clubhead nears the ball in top class golf swings? It looks like the left hip stops and that after contact with the ball, the right hip zooms through until the pelvis faces the target.

On a related topic, is it correct to say that to make the clubhead go as fast as possible at the ball, everything not moving in the same direction as it should stop?

Like this effect in Tim Lincecum's pitch, where you can see the front leg pretty much back away from the target as the delivery of the arm forward starts ("The hips stop abrubtly and the upper body whips through") which was posted on here before.

Tim Lincecum 97 mph fastball | Somax Analysis - YouTube
 
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