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Damon Lucas

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More specifically, I am looking for approximate numbers of forward bending of the club moments before impact.

Brian mentioned in another post 4 degrees as a possibility(correct me if I am wrong). I doubt though that that number is the same from driver to short irons to pitch shots.

Thnx
 
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All4Golf

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Damon Lucas said:
More specifically, I am looking for approximate numbers of forward bending of the club moments before impact.

Brian mentioned in another post 4 degrees as a possibility(correct me if I am wrong). I doubt though that that number is the same from driver to short irons to pitch shots.

Thnx
Click to expand...

I do not have any specifics to be of help here. There are too many variables involved for an before impact approximation of this effect.

I find it is better to focus more on creating the launch consistently. If there is some forward bending taking place, it will translate into different launch conditions (vertical, push/pull angle, and spin). Perhaps a controlled multi factor experiment can help demystify this effect.

What would you the main contributors of forward bend are ( factors that creating a lot of it and minimizing it)?

Regards,
Todd
 
lia41985

lia41985

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Here's my list:
1.) Tip-stiffness
2.) Shaft material--perhaps this is already accounted for by #1
3.) Clubhead speed--if you were to take the same shaft with the same shaft stiffness and have two golfers with different clubhead speeds, intuitively, it seems that different CHS's would generate different amounts of bending.

#3 has me thinking, Todd--if two golfers with the same clubhead, shaft, and angle of attack hit two balls that are the exact same, will there be a difference in launch angle and backspin? And if so, does clubhead speed account for the difference(s)?
 
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All4Golf

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lia41985 said:
Here's my list:
1.) Tip-stiffness
2.) Shaft material--perhaps this is already accounted for by #1
3.) Clubhead speed--if you were to take the same shaft with the same shaft stiffness and have two golfers with different clubhead speeds, intuitively, it seems that different CHS's would generate different amounts of bending.

#3 has me thinking, Todd--if two golfers with the same clubhead, shaft, and angle of attack hit two balls that are the exact same, will there be a difference in launch angle and backspin? And if so, does clubhead speed account for the difference(s)?
Click to expand...

1) Tip stiffness
1a) Tip torque? I have a shaft that can nearly be rotated 75-90* but has the stiff feeling of a XXXXX

2) Shaft material can be endless of combinations... fiber weave, weight, bend profiles. It can get overwhelming here.
Could the amount of forward bending be related to the natural balance point of assembled club? (ex: butt to balance point) A low butt to balance point (LBBP) means theres a lot more to flex from the balance point to clubhead. This scenario would open the door for a higher ClubSpeed to cause more bending).
​

3) Interesting that you bring this up. It's better to focus on the ballspeed because we know that measured value a lot better than CS. Ball speed is also a function of contact location on the club (ex: toe hit).

I'll post some LM data of two golfers of different clubspeeds. Same heads, same assembly, 4 different shafts. This will happen later today when I have some free time. This is necessary because it focuses the subject much better and brings in an important factor to consider. Let's say you have two clubs: same heads, different shaft, same desirable distance result, but two different feels at impact. How do you decide between the two? Do you go with the one that FEELS the best?

Regards,
Todd
 
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All4Golf

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Update - two different golfers, different ball speeds

The numbers were posted on a different golf forum but it's being available for the first time here in OptimalFlight format. (source: Bruce from the http://www.usgolfacademy.com/ )

Same MP57 head, 4 different shafts, all built the same. Summary results from a set of shots presented.

Note: OptimalFlight is in excellent agreement with all 4 results (carry #'s on the highlighted light blue row)

Golfer1_MP57.jpg


What to look for:
1) Higher ball speed player (above picture) created more launch (2-4*)
2) This higher launch also contributed to a steeper landing angle.
3) The amount of spin is similar. Stiffest result PX6.5 generated the most spin.

Flight D average is a bit questionable - which can be a result of shot to shot inconsistency. I suspect a shot or two would have been better left out of the average summary analysis.

Golfer2_MP57.jpg


What can we conclude here? PX5.5 is comparable to DGS300, where the DGS300 generates a bit more 300rpm more spin but not significant enough to have a 'minor' effect.

So - we have two shafts producing similar results for the same 6iron head. The final decision becomes an easy one - whichever one 'feels' the best. Some golfers may favor PX5.5 over DGS300. For others, it is the other way around.

Launch monitor testing with a 'purpose' like this accelerates an understanding of what's happening, why, and can lead to smarter equipment decisions to complement a player's game and swing.

Regards,
Todd
 
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multi

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Wow great post!

PX and DSG seem so similar, I wonder if other shafts would be different. Do you have data for other shafts as well?
 
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All4Golf

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multi said:
Wow great post!

PX and DSG seem so similar, I wonder if other shafts would be different. Do you have data for other shafts as well?
Click to expand...

That study was pretty unique. It is the tip of the iceberg of benefits of working with a clubfitter who has a launch monitor to discover these differences.

I do have some driver data (same head, different shafts). There's just too many possibilities that can be done in a fitting. If you're curious enough, set up an experiment! Do not look at the results until after all data is gathered to keep it objective and unbiased.

Regards,
Todd
 
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