Jimmy Ballard

[trickyric67]

learned something interesting about him yesterday, JB is not a PGA member even though he was Golf Digests teacher of the decade for the 80's and he quit GD because they had a policy of supporting each teachers articles and at the time Flick and Toski were teaching hands which was the polar opposite of JB and he didn't feel that he could support their theories.

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

So i have taught all different kinds of studetns, taken lessons from a few people other than brian and i have also been around other teachers giving lessons.

Generally any lesson you take has some "good" in it; especially on perspective or even on "translation." Just make sure to keep the good FOR YOU and junk the rest.

 

[Richie3Jack]

learned something interesting about him yesterday, JB is not a PGA member even though he was Golf Digests teacher of the decade for the 80's and he quit GD because they had a policy of supporting each teachers articles and at the time Flick and Toski were teaching hands which was the polar opposite of JB and he didn't feel that he could support their theories.

That's pretty much the way I remember it. I was talking about this somewhere else, but JB is big into the left side connection (#4 PP for TGM people) and then Leadbetter took it and aped it off of JB and created a swing connection training aid and treated like his own. Plus, Flick and Toski were never afraid to take shots at Jimmy and he's the type of guy if you do that, he'll never forgive you. He certainly does like to hide his feelings.

If I remember he was basically a member of the PGA and then well into his membership they wanted him to take the PAT and he didn't feel he needed to since he was already a member and he just dropped his membership. I understand there are plenty of PGA certified professionals on this board, but it's stuff like this that is why I am not a fan of the PGA and I think the golfers put a lot more into than they get out of it.






3JACK

 

[Brian Manzella]

Have a good time.

If I had the chance, I'd take a lesson from him as well.

Always better to get it from the horse's mouth.

And, no matter what he does to you, I can fix it if it was a downgrade.

 

[Steve Hale]

If I remember he was basically a member of the PGA and then well into his membership they wanted him to take the PAT and he didn't feel he needed to since he was already a member and he just dropped his membership. I understand there are plenty of PGA certified professionals on this board, but it's stuff like this that is why I am not a fan of the PGA and I think the golfers put a lot more into than they get out of it.

3JACK

Richie, IMHO if you can't break 156 from 6,000 yards and pins set in the middle of greens, you probably shouldn't call yourself a PGA golf professional. At some point, the PGA has to draw a line in the sand with respect to playing ability. And to drop your PGA membership because you can't, or won't, prove your basic worth as a player seems silly.

Now, to qualify this statement I will say that I have no idea if this even applies to JB. My point is simply the PGA needs to include playing ability as a basic tenet of what it means to be a golf professional.

This isn't to say there aren't problems within the PGA, because there are many, but I hope they will always keep a reasonable playing standard (maybe even more stringent that the one now in place) as a requirement for admission.

I usually agree with and enjoy many of your opinions, and respect your posting skills, but as a PGA Professional I am a little sensitive to your above comment.

 

[Richie3Jack]

Richie, IMHO if you can't break 156 from 6,000 yards and pins set in the middle of greens, you probably shouldn't call yourself a PGA golf professional. At some point, the PGA has to draw a line in the sand with respect to playing ability. And to drop your PGA membership because you can't, or won't, prove your basic worth as a player seems silly.

I agree with that, but not with the way it was handled on JB's perspective (at least from what I gather). You don't make a guy a member and then years after say he has to take a PAT. It's a bit disrespectful. Plus, let's say he goes out and shoots 72-73 and then he has to worry about competitors saying that he only could shoot a 145 score off the whites. If they had asked to do the PAT when JB first was trying to get into the PGA, then that's fine. But to do it when he's well into the PGA I think is just rude. Plus, I don't think they made other pros like Flick or Toski do the same.

My problem with the PGA is that the it's like a union but without a lot of the important benefits that your typical unions can provide such as helping increase the PGA members pay, improving work conditions, making it harder for companies to fire people, etc. The PGA provides golfers with access in that it's very hard to become a Head Pro without a PGA certification, but it always came across to me as something that 'self fulfilling' for the PGA to give the Association importance.

I think most of the PGA members I've come across are downright excellent people and workers, I just don't like the PGA and I think it takes great advantage of them.




3JACK

 

[trickyric67]

Down here in SoFlo I am starting to see a lot more head pro's that were mini tour players for years that are not PGA members. I have a good friend who has played in a few PGA tour events as a open qualifier back in the early 90's and he finally decided to give up the minis and get a club job. The PGA wants pretty big bucks these days from apprentices and while he would take the PAT if that was all he had to do he would, he doesn't have the green to pay for the classes and materials. He did get a head pro job though and will probably join when his finances get squared.
Also a lot of clubs down here aren't paying the fee's and dues for the pro's anymore.

 

[trickyric67]

Thanks for the support Brian.
I really only thought to do it because you paid him respect and that was all I needed.

 

[Steve Hale]

I agree with that, but not with the way it was handled on JB's perspective (at least from what I gather). You don't make a guy a member and then years after say he has to take a PAT. It's a bit disrespectful. Plus, let's say he goes out and shoots 72-73 and then he has to worry about competitors saying that he only could shoot a 145 score off the whites. If they had asked to do the PAT when JB first was trying to get into the PGA, then that's fine. But to do it when he's well into the PGA I think is just rude. Plus, I don't think they made other pros like Flick or Toski do the same.


3JACK

Ok, I see, they retroactively made him take the PAT? If that is the case, then sure, that is ridiculous.

 

[trickyric67]

Ballard lesson in the book!
first let me say that i got there and he was giving a lesson in front of about 10 people and all I could think was "oh no, an entourage". It turns out that the college player he was teaching brought the Minyan (a Jewish term for a group of 10 men).when they left Jimmy's wife came and video taped my swing from front, Dl and back. We then went into a teaching studio to watch the video. The walls were covered with pictures of stars of the game from their primes and not so primes. Jimmy goes over connection and firing the right side. We go over "elbows down" at address and left elbow down throughout the swing. We go outside and begining to hit balls and in between shots Jimmy regales me with stories of Hogan, Sam Byrd, George Knudson,Jim Colbert, Hal Sutton and many others. It was like we knew each other for years. He is truly a kind and warm man. He signed some books for me also.
as far as the instruction he loved the backswing that Brian and I worked on as well as "stepping down on the right foot" I would have to say that the method is very similar to NHA2.0. His instruction is very simple to understand and the only real difference, if you could call it that was that he believes the left arm needs to fold and not pull the club but rather go for a ride while the right side fires through and you keep your right hip high to end in a more level position.
thats my review for now.
Ric

 

[footwedge]

Ballard lesson in the book!
first let me say that i got there and he was giving a lesson in front of about 10 people and all I could think was "oh no, an entourage". It turns out that the college player he was teaching brought the Minyan (a Jewish term for a group of 10 men).when they left Jimmy's wife came and video taped my swing from front, Dl and back. We then went into a teaching studio to watch the video. The walls were covered with pictures of stars of the game from their primes and not so primes. Jimmy goes over connection and firing the right side. We go over "elbows down" at address and left elbow down throughout the swing. We go outside and begining to hit balls and in between shots Jimmy regales me with stories of Hogan, Sam Byrd, George Knudson,Jim Colbert, Hal Sutton and many others. It was like we knew each other for years. He is truly a kind and warm man. He signed some books for me also.
as far as the instruction he loved the backswing that Brian and I worked on as well as "stepping down on the right foot" I would have to say that the method is very similar to NHA2.0. His instruction is very simple to understand and the only real difference, if you could call it that was that he believes the left arm needs to fold and not pull the club but rather go for a ride while the right side fires through and you keep your right hip high to end in a more level position.
thats my review for now.
Ric

Nice!

 

[vjsinger]

Can someone explain to me exactly what ballard means by his "connection" theory? Is it on the Backswing, Downswing, Both?

 

[softconsult]

Here you go. From "How to Perfect Your Golf Swing", copyright 1961.

Quote,"The word I found was "connection." The physical activity of any top level athlete was connected, as opposed to being a disjointed or disconnected action. And it seemed to me to be particularly apparent in any of the string or stick and ball sports. Whether the athlete was wing a club, racquet, bat or paddle, the very best players controlled the hands and arms with the big muscles of the body--the large muscles of the legs, torso and shoulders-- rather than with the smaller muscles of the arms and hand.

 

[trickyric67]

His connection is relative to the triangle created by the arms and shoulders from the elbow up, the left bicep stays against the chest softly and you maintain this connected triangle throughout the swing. also the hands basically maintain a direct relationship to the sternum.

 

[self-mastery]

How did you hit the ball with your Ballard swing?

 

[trickyric67]

it was so much like the pattern I have worked on with Brian that it was pretty good. I think the best part was the stories and the fact that what I have been working on with Bmanz was praised by a legend. I like Brians get left as fast you can better than the down the line soft left arm though.Otherwise it was very similiar.

 

[cmartingolf]

Ric,

Nice experience. Thanks for sharing. My mentor as a kid was Knudson. He was a JB fan. I could never get over the "spring the shaft," but as I got older I realized, the longer the club, the more that applied. Clubs release differently, or should anyway. Just don't "spring" your short irons

 

[trickyric67]

Brian did a youtube video on "can you use to much right hand" and the answer was no.
Brian really explains what Ballard called springing the shaft in a clear and understandable manor.

 

[trickyric67]

Another thing to add,
we talked about Bmanz and trackman and I wouldn't be surprised if Jimmy checked out the website. I happen to be very open and honest with instructors about the other people I have worked with that I liked or disliked and why.
As far as Knudson, he told me that back in 1969 or 70 George came to see him and after watching what he was teaching he told him he couldn't learn from him because he advocated folding the left arm and he never let his right arm go over his left, Jimmy asked how he played in the masters and George said "I hit 70 greens and came in 2nd". Jimmy had movie reel that someone had taken at the tournament and showed George that he indeed folded that left arm on every swing. They were together from that point on.
Jimmy also said that Knudson was a meticulous note taker and one night after a lot of Whiskey George pulled out his notes from every tournament he had played and was laughing so hard he may have pee'd himself because what he was feeling he wasn't doing. Unfortunately they used a lot of the notes in the book that bares his name.
that is what Jimmy told me anyway.

 

[dthobbs]

Ballard lesson in the book!
first let me say that i got there and he was giving a lesson in front of about 10 people and all I could think was "oh no, an entourage". It turns out that the college player he was teaching brought the Minyan (a Jewish term for a group of 10 men).when they left Jimmy's wife came and video taped my swing from front, Dl and back. We then went into a teaching studio to watch the video. The walls were covered with pictures of stars of the game from their primes and not so primes. Jimmy goes over connection and firing the right side. We go over "elbows down" at address and left elbow down throughout the swing. We go outside and begining to hit balls and in between shots Jimmy regales me with stories of Hogan, Sam Byrd, George Knudson,Jim Colbert, Hal Sutton and many others. It was like we knew each other for years. He is truly a kind and warm man. He signed some books for me also.
as far as the instruction he loved the backswing that Brian and I worked on as well as "stepping down on the right foot" I would have to say that the method is very similar to NHA2.0. His instruction is very simple to understand and the only real difference, if you could call it that was that he believes the left arm needs to fold and not pull the club but rather go for a ride while the right side fires through and you keep your right hip high to end in a more level position.
thats my review for now.
Ric

That is the exact same routine he used when i saw him in 1981 right down to the old pictures and stories of Sam Byrd, Babe Ruth ect.