Lagging Clubgead Takeaway and Twistaway

[ThomasTheTank]

I'd been working successfully on the Twistaway move for a while and found it worked wonders with the short irons but I was a little wayward with the woods

Tried using LCT by inititaing my backswing by turning my hips and feeling the hip movment drag the club back. Felt this kicked my left knee in a lot but got me on plane and right behind the ball. With the longer clubs I was killing the ball, really feeling like the right arm arrived at the ball in the piston position as I transitioned with the lower body (as opposed to thr twistaway where the arms were straighter at impact as I transitioned more with my hands). And is this a good feeling for LCT? Hips shift a little and then turn pulling the arms along low to the ground for a while before flinging them up, hands and wristrs passive?

Also can you combine the Twistaway and LCT movements or should they remain mutually exlcusive? Ive started to play around with a twistaway move for say 7i down for control and a LCT for longer clubs .. does anyone else mix and match like this or is it dangerous?

 

[shootin4par]

mixing and matching, dangerous except for on occasion for a specialty shot

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

I'd been working successfully on the Twistaway move for a while and found it worked wonders with the short irons but I was a little wayward with the woods

Tried using LCT by inititaing my backswing by turning my hips and feeling the hip movment drag the club back. Felt this kicked my left knee in a lot but got me on plane and right behind the ball. With the longer clubs I was killing the ball, really feeling like the right arm arrived at the ball in the piston position as I transitioned with the lower body (as opposed to thr twistaway where the arms were straighter at impact as I transitioned more with my hands). And is this a good feeling for LCT? Hips shift a little and then turn pulling the arms along low to the ground for a while before flinging them up, hands and wristrs passive?

Also can you combine the Twistaway and LCT movements or should they remain mutually exlcusive? Ive started to play around with a twistaway move for say 7i down for control and a LCT for longer clubs .. does anyone else mix and match like this or is it dangerous?

Sure, it's okay to do something with one club and another with other clubs. Your computer can only process so many things. When i first started i "twisted" EVERYTHING. Then as my clubface control got better i only "twisted" certain clubs. Now i don't have to "twist" anything.

The only thing i wouldn't advise is trying to do the lagging clubhead type takeawy AND twist away. One leads itself to standard wrist action (LCT) and one leads itself to single wrist action (twistaway).

Hope that helps

 

[ThomasTheTank]

Im finding that for pitches and knock downs the twistaway gives me real control but if I want distance an LCT with passive wrists seems to work best?

The two swing methods seem to be very different. One is all hands the other is all hips

Does my description of an LCT sound right? Keen to make sure Im doing this the right way so as not to ingrian another bad habit

 

[birdie_man]

Ya I always hit my short irons way better with a twistaway....very crisp....with longer clubs I found it hook prone.....I'm usually a guy who swivels er open anyway...

I screwed around for a long time with using TAway for short clubs and my usual swing for everything else.....(prolly cause my grip was too weak so I had to unless I wanted to full roll a lob wedge...which I find awkward....)...

Now I pretty much use the same swing for everything....small adjustments....same basic swing.

It was a problem for a long time actually.....something that worked equally well for short and long clubs.

I'm a perfectionist tho so I want it all.

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Im finding that for pitches and knock downs the twistaway gives me real control but if I want distance an LCT with passive wrists seems to work best?

The two swing methods seem to be very different. One is all hands the other is all hips

Does my description of an LCT sound right? Keen to make sure Im doing this the right way so as not to ingrian another bad habit

That's because using the twistaway is more of a hitter's move. And with hitting it is easier to hit knockdown's and half shots. Why? Because you don't have to "wait" for centrifugal force to build. That is why i suggest all players to "hit" their short game shots. It eliminates any tempo or rythym in the shot, you simply bring it up and slam it down.

If you want to hit knockdown and half shots (or even short game shots) "swinging" there is a lot more "wait" to the shot because you are waiting for centrifugal force to build and really need well groomed rythym.

Also the twistaway is more "mechanical" but that is because it is teaching you clubface control.

As for how to do the LCT there are multiple options. Brian demonstrates it with the hips starting the swing and the club laggs. However you can start it with your hands if you want or even your shoulders if you want. It's what works best for you.

Personally for me starting with the hips is the most akward thing i could ever do in my swing. The way i use LCT is with my hands. I use a combination of my shoulders and hands to get it going.

 

[mrodock]

That's because using the twistaway is more of a hitter's move. And with hitting it is easier to hit knockdown's and half shots. Why? Because you don't have to "wait" for centrifugal force to build. That is why i suggest all players to "hit" their short game shots. It eliminates any tempo or rythym in the shot, you simply bring it up and slam it down.

If you want to hit knockdown and half shots (or even short game shots) "swinging" there is a lot more "wait" to the shot because you are waiting for centrifugal force to build and really need well groomed rythym.

Also the twistaway is more "mechanical" but that is because it is teaching you clubface control.

As for how to do the LCT there are multiple options. Brian demonstrates it with the hips starting the swing and the club laggs. However you can start it with your hands if you want or even your shoulders if you want. It's what works best for you.

Personally for me starting with the hips is the most akward thing i could ever do in my swing. The way i use LCT is with my hands. I use a combination of my shoulders and hands to get it going.

Jim,

Really enjoyed the post. When you hit short game shots can it work with smooth acceleration or is it far better to bash it? Do you right forearm pickup with twistaway, hold the twist and hit with the forearm on the way down? Do you set the wrists early for shots around the green?

Thanks a lot!

Matt

 

[mrodock]

Thomas,

If you have a Manzella neutral grip or only slightly stronger and you use the lagging clubhead takeaway it might help to twist just a little to ensure a flat left wrist, particularly as you get to the top.

Matt

 

[ThomasTheTank]

Tks for the constructive replies guys. Recently ive definitely tended more to the hitting idea of the twistaway and have been clubbing down and hitting half shots (say a 3/4 6i into a 160 par 3). Find it sooo much easier to keep the ball straight and also work it a little both ways. My picthing and chipping has reached new heights too, in fact with this method i've become ultra confident in my short game (if only I could putt )

I'd like to get some more distance and less pully with the longer clubs with Twistaway though. Have been experimenting with a low and slow twistaway move where I take the club back with the right hand as low to the ground as I can straight back along the target line. Gives me a very straight right arm halfway back. Every now and then i'll murder one like this but it doesnt 'feel' as zippy as getting the club working up the wall earlier?

Any thoughts on how to get more distance and less pull with a twistaway move with Driver and Fairway woods?

 

[cgrider]

LCT

That's because using the twistaway is more of a hitter's move. And with hitting it is easier to hit knockdown's and half shots. Why? Because you don't have to "wait" for centrifugal force to build. That is why i suggest all players to "hit" their short game shots. It eliminates any tempo or rythym in the shot, you simply bring it up and slam it down.

If you want to hit knockdown and half shots (or even short game shots) "swinging" there is a lot more "wait" to the shot because you are waiting for centrifugal force to build and really need well groomed rythym.

Also the twistaway is more "mechanical" but that is because it is teaching you clubface control.

As for how to do the LCT there are multiple options. Brian demonstrates it with the hips starting the swing and the club laggs. However you can start it with your hands if you want or even your shoulders if you want. It's what works best for you.

Personally for me starting with the hips is the most akward thing i could ever do in my swing. The way i use LCT is with my hands. I use a combination of my shoulders and hands to get it going.

Jim

I tested the LCT with using the left hip proceedure, it worked well on the range, but on the course I lost the clubface way right(shank) on some important shots. One guy playing with me, said I am coming out of my spine angle and club is going too flat left after impact. Glancing blows. I think being new to this, I believe with LCT using left hip, you have to make sure you use the left hip to bring it back. I think I was coming down with the hands and arms overriding the left hip.

Do you use LCT for most all your full shots or some other procedure?


Is there any vid clips on LCT the way you explain it.

 

[mrodock]

Is there any vid clips on LCT the way you explain it.

I believe the new video of Gregg McHatton's swing is a perfect example of a hands leading LCT.

Matt

 

[cgrider]

LCT

I believe the new video of Gregg McHatton's swing is a perfect example of a hands leading LCT.

Matt

Matt

How are you doing the LCT? With left hip? Did you find at anytime in your swing you got a little armsy and lost it right?

 

[mrodock]

Matt

How are you doing the LCT? With left hip? Did you find at anytime in your swing you got a little armsy and lost it right?

I was using the left hip. Haven't felt too armsy yet. I lose it right when I don't swivel correctly, dont' think it is because of the LCT at all.

Matt

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Jim,

Really enjoyed the post. When you hit short game shots can it work with smooth acceleration or is it far better to bash it?

Depends on what you're trying to achieve, meaning what shot you are trying to hit.

Do you right forearm pickup with twistaway, hold the twist and hit with the forearm on the way down?

Yes with short game shots i use pretty much a RFP with single wrist action. I don't need any extra twist, but i used too. As my clubface control became better i didn't need it as much.

When you "hit" you are pushing against pp#1.

Do you set the wrists early for shots around the green?

Thanks a lot!

Matt

Again, depends on the shot you are trying to pull off.

 

[mrodock]

Thank you very much Jim!

 

[ThomasTheTank]

Do you right forearm pickup with twistaway.

This is something im really trying to work on, blending those 2 moves together .. any one got any good advice on how to feel and time these moves and how to check its right?