less shoulder turn, more width on the downswing

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Jim Kobylinski

Super Moderator
I always here this on TGC and from PGA pros saying they shortened their backswing but keep the "width" on the downswing. I never quite understood how they did that but i was trying this at the range tonight and started to get the hang of it.

Basically i wasn't turning back as much but i was making sure i didn't break down my left arm on the downswing. I was hitting very crisp clean shots. Nothing new or out of the ordinary but i did seem to be able repeat these shots easier since i wasn't focussed on a big shoulder turn.

However i noticed that if i tried to increase my swing speed a little more i started to come over the top some and get some nasty pulls.

Is this a good thing, bad, doesn't matter?

Also one more thing, i was trying to get a better idea about where my balance is in my swing so i decided to hit balls with my eyes closed. Not sure why but i was using my 4 iron and i'd say about 1 out of 3 shots i just absolutely flushed and hit an extra 5-10 yards further. This helped me smooth out the swing a little when i applied that to my swing with my eyes open, it was there again. It was an interesting experience.
 
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Jim Kobylinski

Super Moderator
LOL, i don't know...you tell me haha.

Maybe i'm explaining it wrong. I guess what i was trying to do was not shortening the arc on the downswing that i created on the backswing. Does that sound better?
 
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ragman

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quote:Originally posted by jim_0068

LOL, i don't know...you tell me haha.

Maybe i'm explaining it wrong. I guess what i was trying to do was not shortening the arc on the downswing that i created on the backswing. Does that sound better?
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The pros want to shorten their backswing through width. They can have a full pivot (ala Shigecki Maruyama) with a relatively shorter (and wide) arm swing which will aid consistency.

Keeping the right elbow bend at 90 degrees (applying extensor action) will definitely help to achieve this.

With more width, it becomes more difficult to have the body open up too quickly and leave the club behind.
 
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MizunoJoe

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As was pointed out by someone on this or one of the TGM forums, a width BS CAN lead to a "both arms straight" condition, making the radius too big, which requires a "short-arming" action on the downswing.

My real objection to the width concept is that it's lack of height doesn't give enough "down" and can cause the player to swing forward toward the target - a sweeping action which leads to a bent left wrist and clubhead throw-away.
 
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ragman

New
Brian,

"Ok...start here>>>>Too much slack."

??

The lower body can still initiate the downswing.


MizunoJoe,

"As was pointed out by someone on this or one of the TGM forums, a width BS CAN lead to a "both arms straight" condition, making the radius too big, which requires a "short-arming" action on the downswing."

Not if the towel stays under the arm (or if the left arm doesn't separate from the chest).

breaking90a.jpg


"My real objection to the width concept is that it's lack of height doesn't give enough "down" and can cause the player to swing forward toward the target - a sweeping action which leads to a bent left wrist and clubhead throw-away."

?? It has nothing to do with a flat or steep backswing plane.

You can still have enough "up" as demonstrated by anyone.
 
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mb6606

New
to much width could cause a loss of pressure point #4 "whereever the straight left arm contacts the left side" also loss of accumulator #4
 
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MizunoJoe

New
ragman,

I think you're talking about a swing in which the arms stop their up-plane motion when the shoulders stop turning. I call that a "tight" swing. By a width swing, I mean the effort to get the hands as far to the right as possible, which can cause an elongation of the radius if your left shoulder socket is "loose" enough.
 
B

Brian Manzella

Administrator
Get to the 'top' of the position that everyone is talking about:

Short arm swing/ lots of shoulder turn.

In that position if you can move your shoulders FORWARD or your arms BACKWARD and the other doesn't move>>>>>you have too much slack and are asking for lots of grief.
 
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DDL

New
When thinking of the popularly described wide backswing that Harmon, Leadbetter and company preach on The Golf Channel, I think there is a tendency to not have a fully 3 dimenional up the plane motion of back, up and in. Lots of back and up, but not enough in.
 
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matt

New
quote:Originally posted by DDL

When thinking of the popularly described wide backswing that Harmon, Leadbetter and company preach on The Golf Channel, I think there is a tendency to not have a fully 3 dimenional up the plane motion of back, up and in. Lots of back and up, but not enough in.
Click to expand...

Yes...you have to bring that club UP the inclined plane, right from startup.

Too many people get it going way BACK from the ball and think that's width. That's not width - that's an offplane backswing motion.
 
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matt

New
quote:Originally posted by brianman

What about slack???
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Your below-plane Extensor Action will keep the left arm straight.

Using a right forearm pickup that traces the plane line and the appropriate amount of extensor action will keep everything on-plane...and taut.
 
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ragman

New
quote:Originally posted by MizunoJoe

ragman,

I think you're talking about a swing in which the arms stop their up-plane motion when the shoulders stop turning.
Click to expand...

Basically, yes.

quote:I call that a "tight" swing. By a width swing, I mean the effort to get the hands as far to the right as possible, which can cause an elongation of the radius if your left shoulder socket is "loose" enough.
Click to expand...
I agree on what can happen to the radius if one hyperextends at the left shoulder.
 
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