Minimal offset irons, high launch....possible?

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birly-shirly

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Jim Kobylinski said:
no, it's simply due to the design of the shaft itself; also i'd bet that on a launch monitor the project x would launch higher but not spin as much thus your perceived lower ball flight is simply a result of using a project x shaft..higher initial launch with a flatter overall flight.
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Jim - have you seen how the differences show up in trackman/flightscope club variables? Higher launch would register higher dynamic loft, but what would be the cause of the lower spin? I would have guessed lower spin loft, but then I'm struggling to visualise how a shaft change could deliver both higher dynamic loft and lower spin loft. Is this what happens, or is there another variable that impacts spin rates?
 
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Jim Kobylinski

Super Moderator
birly-shirly said:
Jim - have you seen how the differences show up in trackman/flightscope club variables? Higher launch would register higher dynamic loft, but what would be the cause of the lower spin? I would have guessed lower spin loft, but then I'm struggling to visualise how a shaft change could deliver both higher dynamic loft and lower spin loft. Is this what happens, or is there another variable that impacts spin rates?
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I am not a design guru but it's the design of the shaft itself that allows the higher initial launch and overall lower spin rate. Project X are also similar to the KB Tour however the KB Tour are a bit easier to play with (both shafts designed by same guy)
 
S

softconsult

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I had a set of Titleist 695's re-shafted from DG300S to Project X 5.5.
The clubmaker told me what the Project X would do to the flight pattern.
He was correct. Project X sort of goes straight up to the apex and then
flattens out. DG is more of rise from low to high pattern. Hard to describe.

That was last year. This year I have been playing Titleist 735's with DG300S.
I have two sets (e_Bay is wonderful). Going to reshaft one set with KBS 5.5
softstepped once. Should be interesting.

But come on. The problem is the swing. Plays a couple of times a month
and can't practice. Poster should not expect a club change to solve his
problems with low ball flight.
 
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birly-shirly

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Dunno about that at all. Aren't the OP's current clubs pretty classic blades - thin sole and relatively tall CoG? If you really believe that a club change won't help him hit the ball higher, then the last 30 years of iron development have been pretty wasted. Hell, some people think modern clubs are hurting swings by getting the ball up in the air too easily.

Yes - "the problem is the swing" - since the OP used to be able to hit them fine and the clubs themselves haven't changed. But there's a pretty broad range of options out there between those titleists and a set of callaways - and for my money, most of the benefit of "game improvement" irons lies in the ease of getting the ball airborne.
 
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jpeck

New
softconsult said:
I had a set of Titleist 695's re-shafted from DG300S to Project X 5.5.
The clubmaker told me what the Project X would do to the flight pattern.
He was correct. Project X sort of goes straight up to the apex and then
flattens out. DG is more of rise from low to high pattern. Hard to describe.

That was last year. This year I have been playing Titleist 735's with DG300S.
I have two sets (e_Bay is wonderful). Going to reshaft one set with KBS 5.5
softstepped once. Should be interesting.

But come on. The problem is the swing. Plays a couple of times a month
and can't practice. Poster should not expect a club change to solve his
problems with low ball flight.
Click to expand...

Yes, the problem is the swing, but the clubs no longer match the golfer. Perhaps a couple of 20 minute swing speed workouts a week would help.
 
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softconsult

New
I like the phrase, the club no longer fits the golfer. Should have thought about
it longer. Brian posted about a month or so ago about what irons he would buy
based on Trackman numbers. He was pretty emphatic about Ping G15 irons.

I got all heated up and went and hit them. They are nice. They truly do hit
the ball higher. If I had trouble with that issue, I would change to something like
the G15.

All the original poster has to do is find a course or range with the various fitting
carts and test for the best fit.
 
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Short Game Frankie

New
softconsult said:
I like the phrase, the club no longer fits the golfer. Should have thought about
it longer. Brian posted about a month or so ago about what irons he would buy
based on Trackman numbers. He was pretty emphatic about Ping G15 irons.

I got all heated up and went and hit them. They are nice. They truly do hit
the ball higher. If I had trouble with that issue, I would change to something like
the G15.

All the original poster has to do is find a course or range with the various fitting
carts and test for the best fit.
Click to expand...


Keep in mind, guys that I still shoot in the low 80's with a couple of three putts, a lost ball/penalty drop and a few loose shots here and there. My iron play is still very solid. I would just like to look into some clubs that have extremely minimal offset but will offer more forgiveness and higher trajectory. The Ping irons traditionally have enormous amounts of offset. I draw the ball with .080 mm of offset (almost none) and my miss is a hook. Seems like a tall order to try to find a set of clubs with minimal offset with allowable forgiveness and high trajectory.
 
Jwat

Jwat

New
If you want to hit the ball higher get the AP2's. Will definitley get the ball more up in the air.
 
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greenfree

Banned
Short Game Frankie said:
Keep in mind, guys that I still shoot in the low 80's with a couple of three putts, a lost ball/penalty drop and a few loose shots here and there. My iron play is still very solid. I would just like to look into some clubs that have extremely minimal offset but will offer more forgiveness and higher trajectory. The Ping irons traditionally have enormous amounts of offset. I draw the ball with .080 mm of offset (almost none) and my miss is a hook. Seems like a tall order to try to find a set of clubs with minimal offset with allowable forgiveness and high trajectory.
Click to expand...

If your iron play is solid, maybe your irons are o.k.:) There is no forgiveness in golf, only in confession, it's a cruel game in a sort of sick fun way.:D
 
R

RVArya

New
SGF
Have you looked at Ralph Maltibie designs (Golfworks.com). I think they what you are looking for-- High Launch , minimal offset forged clubs. Get a 5 or 6 iron made and demo them before you buy the whole set. The price wont break your bank balance.

Shafts: For the same frequency/stiffness the launch angle are Rifle > TT-DG > Project X.
 
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softconsult

New
Hard for me to see how offset is going to hit the ball higher. Isn't this
design aspect simply intended to allow a nanosecond more time to square
the face. I would think a better player would simply adjust to this.

Loft is logically the most influential spec relative to flight path height.
The Super Game improvement clubs are typically 2-3 degrees stronger in loft to
keep the launch down offsetting the low CG's effect of launching higher.
 
B

birly-shirly

New
My understanding is that offset helps launch the ball higher, for a given static loft, in the same way as a rearward CoG does in a metalwood. As you say, loft is the most influential spec to flight path height. I believe that both design features work to increase dynamic loft by shifting the CoG rearwards, relative to the shaft.

Could you do away with offset and just increase static loft to compensate? AFAIK, probably. I don't know what the downside would be - other than losing the offset. I don't know how to quantify the amount of extra "face-closure" that you get from offset. But if people think that blades are more "workable", then who's to deny the psychological benefits of looking at a chunky offset and believing that this is going to help you square the club?
 
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spktho

New
MP32's are great feeling clubs and kind of forgiving. I went to these about a year and a half ago thinking that it would control the left shot and I hit them super high. I then thought they weren't forgiving enough and went to MP60's because they had a cavity. Both are great feeling clubs when hit solid, but I just didn't do that often enough.

I then saw K.J. Choi playing Ping G15's and saw Brian pint out that he would like to try some and thought if a pro can use those, so can I. So, I got a demo set for a pretty good price, reshafted them, put new ribbed grips on turned so that when I take my grip the face is square and have played some of the best rounds yet. They have a big offset, but with the grips on how I have them, it really doesn't matter. You can also hit the ball high easily and I now know what a forgiving club is.
 
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