More Around If Tall

[eric54]

I am 6ft 4 and was reading some commentary from Matt Kuchar's coach in an article in a UK golf magazine. Basically he said that tall people should swing around more to balance their steeper shoulder plane. Not sure I agree with this but would be interested to hear what people who know much more about the swing think

 

[coachwalls]

Bubba Watson is 6 ft 3. You just need to use what ever plane works best for you.

 

[mgranato]

I'm 77" and would miss the ball if I swung more around. Kuch uses a particular method that has kept him in queue at the bank, but it is not a method that works for all people of size. I think a lot depends on what you already bring to the table, or in my case, remove from the table.

 

[Bigwill]

All tall guys aren't built alike. Longer legs vs. shorter legs will affect the inclination of the torso, and thus the steepness of the shoulder turn. If your waist is up in your armpits, it may help to feel more around to balance things out if you are too steep. But if you look at guys like Bubba or Davis, who are tall and yet stand pretty upright, that advice may not apply and could do more harm than good.

That doesn't even take into consideration the thickness of the players arms and chest, and the range of motion of their shoulders, which could also affect how flat or upright they swing their arms in relation to their shoulders.

You have to be careful which advice you take; it may not apply to you, even when it seems like it may at first blush.

 

[art]

I am 6ft 4 and was reading some commentary from Matt Kuchar's coach in an article in a UK golf magazine. Basically he said that tall people should swing around more to balance their steeper shoulder plane. Not sure I agree with this but would be interested to hear what people who know much more about the swing think

Dear eric54,

The whole full golf swing for an acceptable shot IMO, is TOTALLY dependent upon dynamic stability of (1) the lower body, (2), the upper body/torso, and (3), the lead shoulder complex and arm.

Just looking at the magnitude of the centripetal forces/disturbances these body sections develop during the explosive down swing quickly identifies the challenge every golfer has to hit a long and straight shot, every time.

What seems to be insufficiently emphasized is that the body parts that make up these 3 sections, and the rotational velocities they can generate are UNIQUE to each individual golfer. And the tall ones have to pay even more attention to adequate dynamic balance, and the shallower swing plane is but a small part of the modifications necessary to retain adequate balance.

Respectfully,
art

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Art with all your research have you ever tested the theory that a larger/longer swing arc always contributes to more speed? Always just assumed that the taller you are the more potential you have for speed because you are able to create a longer swing arc to create more speed.

 

[Burner]

Surely if there was anything in this "theory", elite players would not make their down swings on a very much narrower arc than their back swings.
Never seen a good player yet whose down swing is wider than his back swing.

 

[leon]

Surely if there was anything in this "theory", elite players would not make their down swings on a very much narrower arc than their back swings.
Never seen a good player yet whose down swing is wider than his back swing.

Not sure it follows, given that you aren't trying to create speed on your backswing.

You would think intuitively that longer 'levers' in a taller player gives potential for faster clubhead speed. This assumes that you have comparable rotational velocity, or torque if you want to think in forces. And of course that a taller player, with a centre of mass potentially higher from the ground, is able to maintain dynamic stability at a higher swing speed.

 

[art]

Art with all your research have you ever tested the theory that a larger/longer swing arc always contributes to more speed? Always just assumed that the taller you are the more potential you have for speed because you are able to create a longer swing arc to create more speed.

Dear Jim,

First an apology for the delay in responding, my 78 year YOUNG memory could not help in re-locating this post of yours, a growing problem for me as 'traffic' increases in the questions being asked, a problem I am very much enjoying.

Jim, very early, in fact about a month after I started this 5 year 'seeking golf truth journey', I set down a few VERY basic equations to in an almost "back of the envelope" sense, use them to guide me to the MOST important characteristics driving club head velocity. I promise NOT to turn this post into a physics lecture, but let me assure you that your intuition is correct, with one small modification. The longer path MUST be traveled in approximately the same downswing time as the shorter path, and I am not trying to be 'cute' here. Of course, if there was NO acceleration or deceleration of the body parts, a longer path traveled in the same time would BY DEFINITION be going faster.

BUT there is a WHOLE BUNCH of accelerating AND decelerating as seen in the kinematic sequence, so let me get to the next BASIC physics piece that supports your intuition. IF the center of rotation of the swing was constant (we know it is not, but as a first order understanding), the club head speed developed is PROPORTIONAL TO the length of the swing arc, AND the torque applied to the rotating element, the club. So, all the elements affecting club head spped seem to be enhanced with a taller , wider arc individual, BUT CAUTION HERE, as the torque generating AND timing issues can easily over-ride the size advantages.

One quick story, however. Just a few weeks ago, as is my habit, I was just observing some golfers at a local driving range, and was fascinated by a 6 foot 9 inch well coordinated individual hitting right-left-right etc army shots, but always reaching the 250 yard fence on a bounce, in both cornrers. My ACTION CLUE, is when ANY golfer on the range demonstrates DISAPPOINTMENT, or worse yet ANGER from the result vs the expectation difference in the shot. This golfer, later I would learn, had been drafted by the Detroit Pistons out of Giorgia Tech, and was now just a businessman, but clearly IMO, still a very coordinated athlete.

Well as I am sure you have already predicted, I approached him, cautiously, noted my interest in golf science and testing, and predicted in a few minutes he would be having a lot more fun with golf. Skeptical, he let me demonstrate BBKIB, and yes, his first AND EVERY SHOT AFTER THAT cleared the 250 yard , 50 foot high fence, and best of all, down the middle, no more army shots.

An exaggeration, no, that is not my style or desire, just IMO golf truth, breaking thru, in thuis case Jim, with a tall person, I believe coordinated, and capable, because also from the physics, and your intuition, capable of hitting it further.

Hope that answers your question Jim,

Regards,
art

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Yes it does Art.

So back to the original poster, if you are tall use it to your advantage and swing that club just as up as us short people so you have potential to create more speed simply based on your physical attributes.

 

[Bigwill]

Yes it does Art.

So back to the original poster, if you are tall use it to your advantage and swing that club just as up as us short people so you have potential to create more speed simply based on your physical attributes.

What's the best way to shallow all of that "up" for us taller/upright players by the time we get to impact to keep from being too steep at the ball? Axis tilt? Forward ball position? More jump/going normal?

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

What's the best way to shallow all of that "up" for us taller/upright players by the time we get to impact to keep from being too steep at the ball? Axis tilt? Forward ball position? More jump/going normal?

It's no different, the moves are all the same; assuming you're proportionate to the shorter person you are going to have the same feelings of hip/arm movement.