New Break Reading Method
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Tony D'Antonio
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The OP talks about hitting practice putts to gauge slope not about using an iphone app. I get it. Some people learn with a lot of gadgets and numbers others learn by doing, seeing the results, and making subtle, appropriate changes with or without a coach. Believe it or not us old guys learned how to play pretty well without all the gadgets. I'm all for gadgets if they help you but I'm unconvinced that I can learn green reading any better than by hitting a bunch of putts and seeing how the greens run, sort of like the OP but with a bit less math.
Anyway, if the iphone app works for you then use it. No harm in that. I still retain the right to use Rodney's gadget if it ever comes on the market.
Anyway, if the iphone app works for you then use it. No harm in that. I still retain the right to use Rodney's gadget if it ever comes on the market.
jimmyt
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Golf is slow enough......sounds like we are talking about ways of adding time to to an already 4 1/2 hour day. I have to play muni tracks and I'm constantly frustrated by the pace of play...........I guess that's another topic for another time.
For me I say stick to old fashioned remedies. Just hit it closer to the hole and break and slope won't matter. Now that will speed up the pace of play.
For me I say stick to old fashioned remedies. Just hit it closer to the hole and break and slope won't matter. Now that will speed up the pace of play.
Golf is slow enough......sounds like we are talking about ways of adding time to to an already 4 1/2 hour day. I have to play muni tracks and I'm constantly frustrated by the pace of play...........I guess that's another topic for another time.
For me I say stick to old fashioned remedies. Just hit it closer to the hole and break and slope won't matter. Now that will speed up the pace of play.
The game goes a lot faster when you shoot 68 than if you shoot 78. Putting one less time every other hole equates to about 15 minutes of time saved or more. You also feel more confident when you're playing well and confidence tends to quicken your pace both for pre-shot routine and moving between shots. It also translates to better Tee shots and that makes for less time searching for errant balls.
Trust me, speed and better play go hand in hand. The guy that runs to every ball but shoots 102 is WAY slower than the guy who does a 3 swing pre-shot routine for every shot and shoots 68-69.
jimmyt
New
According to all the statistics the chances of a guy shooting a 68 in playing in front of me are about 3-4%. In fact the vast majority of golfers don't break 100. Yet these guys who shoot 100 as I watch them they act as if they shoot 68. Now I play to about an 8 and the guys in my group play ready golf and take very little time over the ball or putt and we all shoot in the 70's.
If the masses would use any system to speed up the round I'm all for it, unfortunately systems like the one being discussed in this topic......the masses which is the 100 shooter will not utilize to speed up the game.
mgranato
New
Golf is slow enough......sounds like we are talking about ways of adding time to to an already 4 1/2 hour day. I have to play muni tracks and I'm constantly frustrated by the pace of play...........I guess that's another topic for another time.
For me I say stick to old fashioned remedies. Just hit it closer to the hole and break and slope won't matter. Now that will speed up the pace of play.
I can promise you that speed/pace of play is 2nd behind score (sometimes in front of score) on my priority list. Reading putts in a manner such as this is a much faster way to play... much faster. There's no plumb bobbing, looking from 3 or 4 different angles, or all the other time crushing actions most golfers take before missing a putt. Guessing and uncertainty always adds time to the process. Walking to put a coin down, I'll know the fall line (the straight putt), recognize the slope around the hole (2%, 3%, etc.), where my ball sits in relation to the fall line, and how long the putt is. Usually by the time the coin goes down, I know where I'm aiming the putter... all that's left is to wait for my turn.
I don't get some of this. Consider just a plain side hill putt. You could aim and putt for the highest part of the putt''s line to be 2' above the hole, or 3' or 4' or 6' or 10'. You have to have perfect pace on any of those to hole it.
How is knowing it's a 5% slope and the green's speed (and where the fall line is) going to help you choose the combination of aim and strength which for you on that hole that day will lead to you actually holing the putt (if that is your destiny)?
How is knowing it's a 5% slope and the green's speed (and where the fall line is) going to help you choose the combination of aim and strength which for you on that hole that day will lead to you actually holing the putt (if that is your destiny)?
Knowing the line can only help, IMO. Sure there are multiple lines that any putt can take and still go in, but as a general rule, each person has a natural pace to all of their putts and therefore an optimal line for THEM.
That being said, there are still three lines to every putt. The line you see, the line you set up to and the line you actually hit.
That being said, there are still three lines to every putt. The line you see, the line you set up to and the line you actually hit.
Kevin Shields
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I certainly would have to see this in action to understand better. I've been reading my putts based on the fall line forever but don't know if it's the same as being described here.
mgranato
New
If we start with the basic premise that we hope to start the putt on the line we aim the putter, aiming the putt for the highest part of the putt's line will absolutely guarantee a low side miss every single time on a breaking putt. If the apex of the balls path is 2' above the hole as it rolls into the center of the cup, the actual aim (starting line) of that putt is significantly higher than 2'. "Perfect pace" is nice, but no one has perfect pace every time - there is a window of pace that will still hole a putt on a given line. The idea on pace IMO should be to have the hole play as wide as possible to "catch" more putts... that's the pace I prefer to putt with. But whatever you own personal target delivery speed is, that's your baseline for the amount of break you play and the determinant of how big your "window" is.
I putt this video together a few years ago for someone. IIRC, it's a 10' putt with the ball rolling at an apex of about 6" above the ball-to-target line (a straight putt). Let's say you are the one making that putt out on a real green, and your playing partner is next to putt be he's just inside you on the exact line. If he's paying attention, he sees the ball break about 6". If he's like most golfers, he lines his putt up and plays 6" of break (the orange dots). He starts it dead on his aim with the exact speed you used, but look how badly he missed. 99.9% of the time, his comment will be "I pushed it" because the ball never got 6" high and he missed well below the hole. The problem wasn't a push, it was that this putt had to be started on a line that was roughly 12" outside the top edge of the hole to make it just inside the low side of the cup.
No one intentionally chooses to make a putt in the low side of the cup, so you could've actually started this putt 14" above the top edge (for a center cup make), or even 16" above the top edge (for a high side make). So for the speed this putt was rolling, there was an effective 4" of break window that would have most likely still made the putt. That's a pretty good sized window for a 4.25" hole.
Knowing the speed creates your baseline. Being able to identify or recognize what a 1%, 2%, 3%, etc. (5% is pretty drastic and the pin placer should be hit in the nuts) looks like begins telling you where you should be starting the putt in relation to the fall line. In the putt above I knew the slope and speed before I started setting up the "putter" and his aim. The only trial and error part of this putt was learning how far up the slide equalled what speed.
Mgranato, thanks for the writeup and vids! I agree the aim line is not to the highpoint of the putting arc. I putt very unconsciously, and so "do" that.
I played this morning and took note of our greens. The most diabolical has 6 feet of elevation change over about 30 feet, and has two intersecting saddles. Other greens are also fairly complex and with fairly high slope. On the two-saddle one, there are multiple options it seems to me. And some days you might want to hit it left of the hole and other days right of the hole, for a hole in about the same basic spot. Aside from the physics point of view, of "will the ball get to the hole from a good side with good speed" etc, there's got to more to the process. But if this is mainly to help you calibrate your feel and sense, I have no problem with it. I'll give it a whirl after further study.
P.s. As there is a difference between fall line and the zero line...and on these severe greens, I would think the fall line is more important. Would this be right?
I played this morning and took note of our greens. The most diabolical has 6 feet of elevation change over about 30 feet, and has two intersecting saddles. Other greens are also fairly complex and with fairly high slope. On the two-saddle one, there are multiple options it seems to me. And some days you might want to hit it left of the hole and other days right of the hole, for a hole in about the same basic spot. Aside from the physics point of view, of "will the ball get to the hole from a good side with good speed" etc, there's got to more to the process. But if this is mainly to help you calibrate your feel and sense, I have no problem with it. I'll give it a whirl after further study.
P.s. As there is a difference between fall line and the zero line...and on these severe greens, I would think the fall line is more important. Would this be right?
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