Not sure I buy the on plane right forearm
- Thread starter Matt Taylor
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This reminds me of the episode of The West Wing where a group of geographers tells CJ Craig, the White House Press Secretary, that the world atlas is biased in favor of Europe and the northern hemisphere. They show her a world map where the countries are shown in their correct proportions, ala Africa and SOouth America are relatively significantly larger. Then the kicker is their presentation of a world Atlas turned upside down where the south pole is on top.. She comments "This is freaking me out". Well those photos from 6B of what is level elicited somewhat more colorful, but similar reaction from moi.
I had, for many months thought level meant the bottom of the forearm was lined up with the wrist on the pinky side. Yoda's original primer showed his arm on top a table in a karate chop position. I don't recall any mention of fingers pointing way downward. Ok, time for me to figuratively put my fingers down my throat, throw up and redigest.
Brian Manzella
Administrator
wow guys...its in the book.
Matt Taylor
New
Hate to say this, but I'm still missing something.
I'm probably looking way too hard at this, but it's still very hard to get my right forearm exactly on plane.
Ed, I fooled around with what you said last night in front of the mirror, and I looked like some natural golf afficianado -- if I put a book where you said to put it and check my wrist, I would need clubs that are about 15* upright.
Brian, I know it's in the book, but I think I'm asking a simple question with a complicated answer. In Manzella style, I'm not taking anything for granted. But I trust the book and homer and I'm trying to figure out what I'm doing wrong -- and at the same time am somewhat skeptical of having your right forearm EXACTLY on plane.
It makes more sense to me to have the forearm just barely above plane, exactly parallel to it, leaving the room that is naturally created by my hand holding on to the club.
When my arm and the club are resting on a table, there is a space where my hand is -- not every part is touching the table. I'm either missing something simple, or there is no way to keep your right forearm exactly on plane with a normal grip.
I know enough to know that it's most likely a Matt problem, so I'm trying to figure it out.
Look, most likely, I'm picking gnat **** out of pepper, putting too fine a point on it, etc. Or just way off base. But I gotta ask, right?
I'm probably looking way too hard at this, but it's still very hard to get my right forearm exactly on plane.
Ed, I fooled around with what you said last night in front of the mirror, and I looked like some natural golf afficianado -- if I put a book where you said to put it and check my wrist, I would need clubs that are about 15* upright.
Brian, I know it's in the book, but I think I'm asking a simple question with a complicated answer. In Manzella style, I'm not taking anything for granted. But I trust the book and homer and I'm trying to figure out what I'm doing wrong -- and at the same time am somewhat skeptical of having your right forearm EXACTLY on plane.
It makes more sense to me to have the forearm just barely above plane, exactly parallel to it, leaving the room that is naturally created by my hand holding on to the club.
When my arm and the club are resting on a table, there is a space where my hand is -- not every part is touching the table. I'm either missing something simple, or there is no way to keep your right forearm exactly on plane with a normal grip.
I know enough to know that it's most likely a Matt problem, so I'm trying to figure it out.
Look, most likely, I'm picking gnat **** out of pepper, putting too fine a point on it, etc. Or just way off base. But I gotta ask, right?
Jim Kobylinski
Super Moderator
You don't have to set the forearm on plane if you don't want too, however good ball strikers do get it on plane somewhere in the back/down swing.
The advantage of setting up the right forearm on plane at setup is to swing on a zero shift type of swing.
The advantage of setting up the right forearm on plane at setup is to swing on a zero shift type of swing.
Matt - double check that you are setting the forearm (and elbow) on plane with the shaft, the right forearm flying wedge, which is not on the same line as the left forearm, but well below it. If you are feeling that 'natural golf' setup, it is likely that the right forearm is much, much higher than it should be, and not in plane with the shaft.
Matt Taylor
New
I'll check, but I've pretty much decided to forget about it. If any of you guys were watching, you'd most likely say that my right forearm is on plane. I'm just trying to be more precise, I guess, but at some point you gotta just hit the fargin ball and lay off the microscope mentality.
I'm hitting it pretty good right now anyway (probably shouldn't have written that. bad gris -gris). But I'm bored at work, and I like talking about this stuff.
Thanks for the input, fellas.
I'm hitting it pretty good right now anyway (probably shouldn't have written that. bad gris -gris). But I'm bored at work, and I like talking about this stuff.
Thanks for the input, fellas.
Brian Manzella
Administrator
Useless?
Matt Taylor
New
Hmmm. Useless?
I'm useless?
The right forearm is useless?
My posting on this subject is useless?
I'm useless?
The right forearm is useless?
My posting on this subject is useless?
FanofHogan
New
Matt Taylor
New
That makes sense.
Oops. My bad.
Oops. My bad.
Hi mb,
Actually, I believe this came from a poll I put up that asked readers to identify Homer Kelley's 'most important swing thought.' That 'thought' was the Right Forearm (and #3 Pressure Point) Tracing the selected Delivery Line during the Downstroke. You may view the complete thread at /www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=430&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 . Meanwhile here are two of my explanatory posts at the conclusion of the polling period.
**************************************
Each of the five Swing Thoughts expressed in the poll were either direct quotes from Homer Kelley or a reasonable facsimile thereof. You couldn't go wrong keeping any one of them in mind during the Stroke. Nevertheless, when asked to identify the most important thing to keep in mind during the swing, he responded without hesitation.
And his answer was...
<drum roll please!>
Number Four: "The Right Forearm tracing down the Delivery Line."
Homer described the Inclined Plane as "the heart and soul" of the golf Stroke. And Tracing the Delivery Line assures staying On Plane. The Delivery Line could be either the true Geometric Plane Line (Swinging) -- the straight line baseline of the Inclined Plane; or, the Angle of Approach (Hitting) -- the geometric equivalent of the Arc of Approach (2-J-3).
He added that the thought might be peculiar to him: He had spent so many years focusing on getting correctly to the Top that he needed a key to get him from the Top through Impact!
Congratulations to the nine percent of the voters who got it right. Now, let's all get out there and Trace!
*************************
DOCW3 said:
No, Doc. This was simply my explanation of Homer Kelley's dilemma: From Address, he visualized himself reaching the Top in perfect alignment, but from there...nothing. In other words, he basically had built only half a swing.
Let's listen to him tell about it:
"The biggest step for me was to visualize -- at Address -- the idea of coming down with the Bent Right Wrist...to 'see' it coming down and staying Bent. It was a big help to me because I would get to the Top, and I would forget about it...my mind would get stuck up there! And the Club would take off without me."
"But you know, until I began to dig up this stuff -- what was the difference? I really didn't have anything to think about on the Downstroke anyway! I didn't know what happened...all I was thinking about was the Green out there -- the Fairway. I really didn't get into position to hit the Ball."
Homer solved his problem with the thought of Right Forearm Plane Line Tracing. He now had a swing key to get him from the Top through Impact. He would visualize this Tracing at Address and remain totally conscious of it throughout the Stroke. It cured his Downstroke Blackout (3-F-5) and was the basis of his quote (from 3-B):
"To develop skill at Golf, your 'attention span' must be at least as long as your swing."
self-mastery
New
This grips appears to be similar to IMA's grip????
Brian Manzella
Administrator
There is no doubt that the "Right Forearm Tracing" is a great concept, but...
...like all concepts, it doesn't work (as a suggestion) for everybody.
...like all concepts, it doesn't work (as a suggestion) for everybody.
Brian Manzella
Administrator
Feel.
And feel of what? Ask the player, and you might not even GET an answer.
What I am saying, Lynn, is that, the CONCEPT and the MECHANICS of "right forearm tracing" is a sound as pie (or pi), but if I told Tiger to do it, he might hit it a foot fat (or win 20 more majors).
In the real world of golf lessons to, often, non-tgmers, like Tiger or for me David Toms, on a driving range of a PGA Tour event or the CITY PARK driving range, it is just an idea or suggestion for the student. One, that, sadly, might ruin a player.
And feel of what? Ask the player, and you might not even GET an answer.
What I am saying, Lynn, is that, the CONCEPT and the MECHANICS of "right forearm tracing" is a sound as pie (or pi), but if I told Tiger to do it, he might hit it a foot fat (or win 20 more majors).
In the real world of golf lessons to, often, non-tgmers, like Tiger or for me David Toms, on a driving range of a PGA Tour event or the CITY PARK driving range, it is just an idea or suggestion for the student. One, that, sadly, might ruin a player.
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