Redgoat article in Golf Tips Magazine

[southpaw]

Some of you may have read an article in the latest Golf Tips magazine by Brady Riggs (aka Redgoat), entiled "Is Your Swing Out Of Date"? It describes the differences between the so-called "modern swing" that many young players are learning, and the actions of some of the greats like Nicklaus, Miller and Trevino.

In essence, Brady advocates a more "stacked up" address on the balls of the feet with more forward tilt and less spine tilt away from the ball. The pivot is rotary, with a flexed right kneee at the top. The swing is also very rotary, with much less lateral hip slide/ hang back, an impact that's more "on top" of the ball (ala Els), and a body release followthrough with the head rotating with the body into the finish.

Some of these ideas seem to differ a little from what you teach, Brian, and some don't. I'd certainly like to hear your opinion on the article, as well as the opinions of others (Lynn Blake, you might have some interesting insights to share).

Disclaimer: Brady is my longtime teacher, and we work on many of the things written about in this article. When we started, I was a chronic hang-back-slide-and-flip throwaway hooker of the ball. Now I'm a much better, more consistent player and swinger of the golf club. I'm also a club longer with everything in the bag (thankfully, not the putter). So my experience with Redgoat has been positive.

That said, feel free to have at it, as I'm sure that everyone here has their own take on this article.

 

[DDL]

link?

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

I'll have to check it out, i always liked Brady's advice.

However i'd like to point out that there's a BIG DIFFERENCE between a normal 2-3" lateral hip slide versus a big LUNGE and also a bid difference between "hanging back" (which forces you to either 1) flip it or 2) stick it in the ground fat) and the LOOK of "leaning to the right" through impact due to axis tilt.

 

[jeffy]

quote:Originally posted by jim_0068

I'll have to check it out, i always liked Brady's advice.

However i'd like to point out that there's a BIG DIFFERENCE between a normal 2-3" lateral hip slide versus a big LUNGE and also a bid difference between "hanging back" (which forces you to either 1) flip it or 2) stick it in the ground fat) and the LOOK of "leaning to the right" through impact due to axis tilt.

I picked it up this morning. Decent article, though I've been reading similar "Learn the Modern Swing" pieces for 30 years...

As far as his "old school" models go, he was pretty selective: Jack, Lee, Payne, Hale and J. Miller. Well, none of those guys had typical swings in any era: noone else ever really swung like Jack or Lee; Payne and Hale are classic Hardy two-planers (very vertical vs. rotational); and J. Miller had a big old reverse C. Missing were the timeless swingers Snead, Hogan, and Mickey Wright; each had power and accuracy. Who swung better than those three, then or now?

 

[EdZ]

quote:Originally posted by jeffy

Who swung better than those three, then or now?

Exactly. They each knew what Jones meant by 'swinging the clubhead' and what Eddie Merins (sp?) called 'swinging the handle'

the club must SWING, and you must not get in its way

 

[swingeasttowest]

Still frame pictures of Swingers doesn't tell the whole story. When you are looking at the impact frame, the swinger is thinking about this impact frame a couple of frames prior. Yes swing the club head, rotate that toe.............

 

[cdog]

EDZ, i have begun to really drill swinging the clubhead, no ball just a pure swing absolutly NO tension or adding on anything to the motion, just feel the rhythm and flo with it. I use whippys, weight on a string, then a club.
Then i add a ball...lol, that damn ball, i can still do it for the real small shots, but when i start to expand, it takes all the discipline i can muster not to add!
What i have found is, when i do this drill, my body does exactly what it needs to do automattically, the wrist alignments are perfect at impact bent/flat. The only thing i try to feel is the clubhead, one longer swing i am trying to refine my feels to the pressure pts, and the feel of the club trying to be pulled from my grip, doing this helps stop tension from moving in, when i play today i am gonna add biting my tongue to the mix (hopefully i dont bite the damn thing off)to help stop tension.
Since doing Brian's suggestion of hitting the ball with the pivot, and expanding the workout to pure swinging drill, i shot my best ever 9 holes of 2 under, i would have been 3 under but 3 putted #9 because of to many thoughts and couldnt relax at all (i dont know how the pro's do it).
I ended up with 4 birds, 3 pars, 2 bogs.....and i feel the main reason was swinging completely relaxed, just feeling the clubhead.

 

[birdie_man]

Noodle arms. Over the ball and throughout the swing.

That's the only thing I strive for over the ball on a FULL swing...once I've got my setup (grip/balance) right.

 

[EdZ]

quote:Originally posted by cdog

EDZ, i have begun to really drill swinging the clubhead, no ball just a pure swing absolutly NO tension or adding on anything to the motion, just feel the rhythm and flo with it. I use whippys, weight on a string, then a club.
Then i add a ball...lol, that damn ball, i can still do it for the real small shots, but when i start to expand, it takes all the discipline i can muster not to add!
What i have found is, when i do this drill, my body does exactly what it needs to do automattically, the wrist alignments are perfect at impact bent/flat. The only thing i try to feel is the clubhead, one longer swing i am trying to refine my feels to the pressure pts, and the feel of the club trying to be pulled from my grip, doing this helps stop tension from moving in, when i play today i am gonna add biting my tongue to the mix (hopefully i dont bite the damn thing off)to help stop tension.
Since doing Brian's suggestion of hitting the ball with the pivot, and expanding the workout to pure swinging drill, i shot my best ever 9 holes of 2 under, i would have been 3 under but 3 putted #9 because of to many thoughts and couldnt relax at all (i dont know how the pro's do it).
I ended up with 4 birds, 3 pars, 2 bogs.....and i feel the main reason was swinging completely relaxed, just feeling the clubhead.

Yep, physics can be your friend if you let it. It is quite a difficult thing to do, to 'give up control' to the swinging force, but once you can do that and stay in balance, you'll find effortless power. It is absolutely amazing how little effort is needed to send the ball a LONG way, given proper impact alingments and a 'swinging on plane force'.

Eyes closed practice with a heavy club can be very beneficial, but it is very tough to stop that 'hit' impulse and to just let the club SWING - like a rock on a string. The 'swing sock' or similar can help you get a better feel for the clubhead too. A great 'swingers' aid.

Nice playing Steve [8D]

 

[DOCW3]

quote:Originally posted by southpaw

Some of you may have read an article in the latest Golf Tips magazine by Brady Riggs (aka Redgoat), entiled "Is Your Swing Out Of Date"? It describes the differences between the so-called "modern swing" that many young players are learning, and the actions of some of the greats like Nicklaus, Miller and Trevino.

In essence, Brady advocates a more "stacked up" address on the balls of the feet with more forward tilt and less spine tilt away from the ball. The pivot is rotary, with a flexed right kneee at the top. The swing is also very rotary, with much less lateral hip slide/ hang back, an impact that's more "on top" of the ball (ala Els), and a body release followthrough with the head rotating with the body into the finish.

Some of these ideas seem to differ a little from what you teach, Brian, and some don't. I'd certainly like to hear your opinion on the article, as well as the opinions of others (Lynn Blake, you might have some interesting insights to share).

Disclaimer: Brady is my longtime teacher, and we work on many of the things written about in this article. When we started, I was a chronic hang-back-slide-and-flip throwaway hooker of the ball. Now I'm a much better, more consistent player and swinger of the golf club. I'm also a club longer with everything in the bag (thankfully, not the putter). So my experience with Redgoat has been positive.

That said, feel free to have at it, as I'm sure that everyone here has their own take on this article.

What caught my attention was a distinguishing position at the top.

There is no lateral weight shift to the right. As the hips complete their rotation in the move back, they "gain" on the target (more left than address). The right knee remains flexed and the left knee appears to bend toward the target line. With the head remaining in the neutral address position, the spine bend away from the target increases. From this position there is no need to re-balance and the body can just pivot into impact. The danger for the average player or someone not understanding the "motion" is a reverse weight shift. There is a drill in the article.

Although detectable from the article photos, Brady comments on the "gain" in a video of Darren Clarke from a rear view, which helps establish the sequence. It is also apparent in the clip at Clarke's web site.

DRW