TGM (And Golf) Lunacy...

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birdie_man

birdie_man

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Brian you are smart for "putting some distance" between you and TGM. Or at least moving away from using the terminology and whatnot.

I was just reading some stuff on some other sites...

It really was making me uneasy. (in my belly)

You're right:

It is not worth the time and effort to debate about things, and usually the same things, over and over. (cyclically)​

I hadn't been on any other instruction sites in a good while.

It really WAS, to use your phrase, like sticking myself into a "time warp." I had to use some restraint to not immerse myself into the same stupid debates with some of the same people (and I would expect a lot of them to know better), but frighteningly- seemingly a lot of new people.

I don't know if it is getting worse, or if I am more aware of it now.

And I am not even a real golf instructor, like yourself. I am not immersed into the golf instruction world anywhere near to the level that you are.

Some may think I am being too negative and am freaking out, or over-reacting, or that I am just biased, or whatever...

But I am generally (almost all the time) not a reactive person. I am very calm and level-headed in real life and also in my "internet life" here. I think of myself as having good judgment, for what it's worth. (though a chronic "misjudger" may also misjudge their ability TO judge so...:D) I say that as modestly as I can, but also proudly. I also am making an effort to remove myself from any biases I may have.

(Also know/remember that any biases I have developed are due to nothing but me gravitating to what I judge to be true. I started with no financial affiliations here and still basically have none. Any personal affiliations have mostly been developed through the internet. I started completely neutral. And the truth is that I would abandon this site in a second if Brian somehow started going wacky and teaching strange things.)

Any"hoo"...

To everyone who does not get it (you may even be new to all this stuff) I just want you all to try and see this post as a "Heads-Up."

From someone who you still might even think is just another crazy, self-appointed internet "Golf Pundit" of some sort:

For what it's worth:

This site is way way way the heck ahead of its time. Seriously. At the very least it could not be called anything but On The Cutting Edge.

There is a lot of bad stuff out there.

...

Sorry I just had to get that out folks. Golf needs to advance. Badly. I have no desire to beat around the bush at this time.

Imagine how Brian feels.

I don't necessarily desire a response to this thread, but anyone can respond if they wish, and as they wish.

Happy golfing in 2009 everyone. :)
 
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D

Damon Lucas

Super Moderator
Good post, Paul!

I, like you, have been around a lot of these sites for several years now, and feel the same. Perhaps I feel more of a responsibility to look at the other sites so that I can understand what some people are thinking and what I have to deal with.

I think it is a very strong testament to Brian especially for the research that he does, the company that he keeps, and the honesty and integrity that is at his core.

Thanks also to Mike F, Tom B, Jim K, Kevin S, Mandrin TG, and most of the members who continue to ask the hard but fair questions.

Damon
 
tongzilla

tongzilla

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If you want to become a TGM enthusiast, I recommend going down the book-literalist path for at least a few months.
 
2mongoose

2mongoose

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Without a doubt

Brian Manzella said:
But, would you recommend becoming an enthusiast?
Click to expand...

I certainly don't know the book well enough to be labeled an enthusiast, perhaps a dabbler, but yes, I would recommend it.

The information (right or wrong as proved by trackman, etc.) is critical in the success of an avid golfer. You can figure out what works and why - and more importantly what doesn't and why Homer (gasp!) was wrong.

It's still one of the best, if not the best, piece of golf literature ever written (arguably :eek:)
 
B

Brian Manzella

Administrator
2mongoose said:
I certainly don't know the book well enough to be labeled an enthusiast, perhaps a dabbler, but yes, I would recommend it.

The information (right or wrong as proved by trackman, etc.) is critical in the success of an avid golfer. You can figure out what works and why - and more importantly what doesn't and why Homer (gasp!) was wrong.

It's still one of the best, if not the best, piece of golf literature ever written (arguably :eek:)
Click to expand...

Would I recommend that someone study and learn from the book, and also realize its shortfalls?

Yes.
 
T

TJE

New
Homer Kelley: one voice in the wilderness

There is much to learn from it but it is not Gospel.

TJE
 
KOC

KOC

New
tongzilla said:
If you want to become a TGM enthusiast, I recommend going down the book-literalist path for at least a few months.
Click to expand...

Leo,

Do you classify yourself as one of the book-literalist before? No? One more question, what exactly mean book-literalist?
 
birdie_man

birdie_man

New
Brian Manzella said:
Would I recommend that someone study and learn from the book, and also realize its shortfalls?

Yes.
Click to expand...

I'm with you Brian.

I know you know this.

But it is "for the record."

(Some may not know I am a TGM supporter...so long as it is as per Brian's quote above, basically...)
 
tongzilla

tongzilla

New
Brian Manzella said:
Would I recommend that someone study and learn from the book, and also realize its shortfalls?

Yes.
Click to expand...
the book is hard enough already. I would not recommend a "non-expert" to try to understand the book AND its shortfalls/flaws at the same time. I am sure you know what I'm talking about Brian.
 
tongzilla

tongzilla

New
more answers

KOC said:
Leo,

One more question, what exactly mean book-literalist?
Click to expand...
Someone who takes things out of the book and applies it literally. E.g. going through every item in the Mechanical Checklist before hitting a shot (there are 45 items).
 
birdie_man

birdie_man

New
cjgolf said:
Birdie,

I was otherwise on the webcast just now.

Probably Iseek. I don't post much at all anywhere these days.
Click to expand...

Yesyes I thought so. (esp. with you being from Australia and all)

I haven't seen you around "internet land" in a while.

Take er easy cj. Soak up some Australian rays (solar rays) for me.

-Paul
 
B

brucifer

New
birdie_man said:
It is not worth the time and effort to debate about things, and usually the same things, over and over. (cyclically)​

I hadn't been on any other instruction sites in a good while.

It really WAS, to use your phrase, like sticking myself into a "time warp." I had to use some restraint to not immerse myself into the same stupid debates with some of the same people (and I would expect a lot of them to know better), but frighteningly- seemingly a lot of new people.
Click to expand...

I think this is a crucial point with regard to the site.

I agree there is a lot of information here, but I haven't been here from the start, and like others, probably ask a lot of the same questions that have already been answered.

I'm sure Brian and the other guys get a little tired answering the same things, and whilst the search facility is good, its not perfect.

I heard that Brian is going to relaunch the site soon, is that correct?

Are there plans to re-organise it in a way to save you guys covering the same ground and help us wasting time making you?

Bruce
 
Steve Khatib

Steve Khatib

Super Moderator
If you are a book literalist you might as well just enjoy the nostalga of it all because the stroke paterns in the book (zero pivot etc) and pure hitting DO NOT work in practical real world teaching period! They are not golf like.... along with all that piston motion chipping etc.

Golf instructors that can't teach need the book more than anyone, as they need to quote it verbatim to validate themselves to the poor followers who dont know better.

My advice is to learn the book and then use the good eg. plane angles, component classifacations and ignore the patterns in the back.
 
T

tobell

New
This site is a testament to Brian's expansive yet deliberate approach. It is always fresh and free of the confines of authoritarian dogma.
 
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