Toe Hits - Help!

[Jim Kobylinski]

quote:Originally posted by ian d m

Why would to upright a lie angle cause toe hits ?

A club that's shorter would tend to contact on the toe, assuming everything else stayed the same.

It has to do with the toe down effect of centrifugal force on the shaft which is why lie angle IS IMPORTANT MizunoJoe.

If you're club is too upright, when the toe "hangs down" it won't "hang down" enough and you'll hit it off the toe. So you bend it flatter, so that when the toe hangs down, the sweetspot of the club will contact the ball.

If you want proof...go bend your lie angles 2-3* more upright than they should be and see (on a lie board) where you make contact. It will be on the toe

 

[sonofwheel]

MizunoJoe: I will have to try addressing the ball out towards the toe. It seems to me that I used to do that several years ago and I never had the toe-hit problem. It might just be the problem is a visual/mental thing. I have had dynamic lie tests done so I don't think it is a lie angle problem.
BTW: I hit some balls today on the range and worked on hitting it from the inside and alignment. I still have some OverTheTop (OTT) but it was a little better. I hit several really good irons and driver shots.

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

sonofwheel...

address the ball as you normally would. Then drop your right foot back about 2 feet. Then try to hit the ball to "right field." Make your goal to hit soft draws.

If you're able to do that...slowly bring your right foot back to your normal position.

 

[MizunoJoe]

quote:Originally posted by sonofwheel

MizunoJoe: I will have to try addressing the ball out towards the toe. It seems to me that I used to do that several years ago and I never had the toe-hit problem. It might just be the problem is a visual/mental thing. I have had dynamic lie tests done so I don't think it is a lie angle problem.
BTW: I hit some balls today on the range and worked on hitting it from the inside and alignment. I still have some OverTheTop (OTT) but it was a little better. I hit several really good irons and driver shots.

The reason it works is that if you go to impact fix and then back to standard address position, the ball will be toward the toe. You want an in-to-out impact of an on-plane clubhead, not an in-to-out clubhead path.

 

[ian d m]

That's the great thing about golf - its so easy to venture off on so many exciting paths............... and end up in an awful labrynth of our own making.

All of this is a bit inexact because we can't see "son of wheel". But some clever people indentified, a long time ago, that "if the club swings on too flat of an angle, its gone too far behind you so it is likely to swing too far out in front of you and you'll shank".

This rule then applies in reverse too: "if the club doesn't swing around enough, it won't swing out in front enough, and you'll hit on the toe."

So, he must look for an upright line in his golf swing (viewed from down the target line) - that shouldn't be there. If he gets the club swinging on more of an arc he will hit closer to the shank which for him will be closer to the middle of the clubface.

 

[sonofwheel]

MizunoJoe: I am sorry but I don't understand the concept of "in-to-out impact of on-plane clubhead".
Jim 0068: The drill you recommended sounds like a good one to work on eliminating my OTT move.

 

[ForeRight]

I'm surprised to read this comment... I've been fit and all my irons are 3 flat. Yes 3 [:0] When I demo irons on the range, it's not very indicative of how they will truely perform. The reason... when I hit it sweet it's anywhere from a 5-10yard draw and much longer. I actually have to TRY and hit a fade in order to see a straight ball flight.

quote:Originally posted by MizunoJoe

Homer said that the lie of the club wasn't significant because the ball is(should be) struck before the clubhead hits the ground.

 

[Jim Kobylinski]

Fore...i wonder if Homer knew the effects of centrifugal force on the clubhead during the swing?

quote: MizunoJoe: I am sorry but I don't understand the concept of "in-to-out impact of on-plane clubhead".

sonofawheel...all he means is this:

the lowest point of the swing should be the outside edge of the left shoulder. If you let your left wrist bend, low point will be behind the left shoulder and if you arch your left wrist, low point will be the arched point outside your left shoulder. So let's just assume a proper flat left wrist with the outside edge of the shoulder being low point.

We place the ball before the outside edge of our left shoulder right? The swing is a tilted circle right? So, knowing the two above you should understand that as the club is coming into impact it is coming from an in to out path, striking the ball BEFORE the low point of the swing, continuing in to out until it reaches low point (somewhere in the divot.)

Hope that helps a little.

 

[MizunoJoe]

quote:Originally posted by sonofwheel

MizunoJoe: I am sorry but I don't understand the concept of "in-to-out impact of on-plane clubhead".
Jim 0068: The drill you recommended sounds like a good one to work on eliminating my OTT move.

sow, if you have the book, read 2-J-2.

 

[sonofwheel]

All this seems right. I am tall (6'4") with relatively short arms and have an upright swing plane. This might explain why I tend to hit the ball off the toe. I will continue to work on flattening my swing plane a little, being sure to approach the ball from a slightly inside move.

 

[Steve Khatib]

Jim I am sorry because you must have upright and flat mixed up, an upright lie angle must cause heel hits not toe hits.

Ben Doyle taught Steve Elkington to shoot from the pivot and arm thrust from the pivot acc#4 and #1 to stop his toe hits on his wedges, before that Elkington was just adding with his hands and arms. By the way I wouldnt mind adding like Elk and making a million$ a year, not bad steering hey!