Too Much Right Arm?

[Keefer]

What's the consensus on whether the golf swing is a dominant arm swing (right for right handers) or a non dominant arm swing (left for right handers)? I'm thinking I have too much right arm in my swing. When timing is on I'm fine, on days when it's off I'm all over the place.

Was reading about the late Leslie King's idea that the golf swing is a lead arm swing. Meaning for righties the left arm / hand take the club back and leads the swing on the downswing also. The theory is if the right arm takes over the swing gets outside the plane and across the line leading to errant shots.

King who later in life taught Juli Inkster and Gary Player was in the same camp as Ernest Jones thinking the arms lead the swing and the body reacts to the arms / hands swinging the club.

Manzella and company seem to have proven this theory scentifically as well (hands / arms lead). Anyway, how do you quiet the right arm and stop it from taking over the swing?

I can't think of any other sport where you would want to play with your non dominant arm leading the way. If this is true then golf truly is a game of opposites.

 

[Lindsey Newman]

Good question that may not be answer-able but here are my opinions.

I am a book student of Toski and Bobby Jones and believe their is much value in their teachings.

I think if you can get the lead arm to control the takeaway then it will remain dominate throughout.

 

[gmbtempe]

I may be in the minority but I don't believe any of that stuff.

Does a baseball player think "do I do this lead arm or trail arm"? To me you are trying to make an athletic motion and you may "feel" like certain muscles are leading the swing but in reality the entire body is making the motion, IMO.

 

[Keefer]

I may be in the minority but I don't believe any of that stuff.

Does a baseball player think "do I do this lead arm or trail arm"? To me you are trying to make an athletic motion and you may "feel" like certain muscles are leading the swing but in reality the entire body is making the motion, IMO.

I would tend to agree if a fairway were as wide as a baseball field obviously extended beyond 300 feet (100 yards) down each line.

The more I read the more I believe that it's the lead arm and hand that must control the swing. Training one to put the dominant arm in a secondary role seems to be the tough thing to do though.

 

[Brian Manzella]

I may be in the minority but I don't believe any of that stuff.

Does a baseball player think "do I do this lead arm or trail arm"? To me you are trying to make an athletic motion and you may "feel" like certain muscles are leading the swing but in reality the entire body is making the motion, IMO.

Mark this down:

When I 100% agree with Greg from Tempe, you should go out an by a chisel and some rock.

 

[mgranato]

I may be in the minority but I don't believe any of that stuff.

Does a baseball player think "do I do this lead arm or trail arm"? To me you are trying to make an athletic motion and you may "feel" like certain muscles are leading the swing but in reality the entire body is making the motion, IMO.

Never saw golf being like baseball at all with respect to this topic. The batter is reacting very quickly to the ball. Golf is the complete opposite. Maybe golf is more like T-ball. A lot of athletic motion has time to submit when the ball is just sitting there looking back at you. I think part of the difficulty in golf is creating an athletic scenario. It's hard to get more athletic and reactionary than Sugar Ray, but my gosh, he had none of that standing over the ball.

Anyways... I'm beginning to find a lot of self-comfort in a virgining belief that golf does not favor athletes.

The alternative is too devastating.

 

[Virtuoso]

If you took the analogy of the baseball pitcher, the obvious response would be that the throwing arm is the dominant arm in the motion, but is the motion of the other arm in complete disregard? Even if the non-throwing arm is not a direct speed multiplier, it seems like it is doing something pretty specific to balance the motion. If the non-throwing arm was made to just hang from the shoulder joint (or stuffed into your pocket), it would degrade the overall efficiency quite a bit.

Thus, in every athletic motion, every move by every body part is important.

 

[Pete J]

Mark this down:

When I 100% agree with Greg from Tempe, you should go out an by a chisel and some rock.

Brian......are you saying that you agree, in part, with Greg? I'm glad someone started this thread because I've struggled with this lead vs trail arm issue for a long time. I've even gone back and forth between using which arm is more dominant during the course of a round. I had a lesson about 15 years ago and the first thing the Pro said was "and don't ask me any of that right vs left arm crap". It was going to be the first thing I wanted to ask him. I think I read somewhere that 80% of PGA Tour Pros are front arm swingers but when I asked some friends who are better players they replied that they don't even think about it. Is this what Greg is saying?

 

[Virtuoso]

Brian......are you saying that you agree, in part, with Greg? I'm glad someone started this thread because I've struggled with this lead vs trail arm issue for a long time. I've even gone back and forth between using which arm is more dominant during the course of a round. I had a lesson about 15 years ago and the first thing the Pro said was "and don't ask me any of that right vs left arm crap". It was going to be the first thing I wanted to ask him. I think I read somewhere that 80% of PGA Tour Pros are front arm swingers but when I asked some friends who are better players they replied that they don't even think about it. Is this what Greg is saying?

Pete, Brian is saying he agrees 100% with gmbtempe.

If you want to find out which arm is dominant in your swing, just grab a gallon of milk/water with both hands and fling it around your yard. Take the handle in your left hand and hold the other side with your right hand and sling it with your golf motion. Maybe you'll find one arm dominating slightly but probably not by much.

 

[gmbtempe]

Brian......are you saying that you agree, in part, with Greg? I'm glad someone started this thread because I've struggled with this lead vs trail arm issue for a long time. I've even gone back and forth between using which arm is more dominant during the course of a round. I had a lesson about 15 years ago and the first thing the Pro said was "and don't ask me any of that right vs left arm crap". It was going to be the first thing I wanted to ask him. I think I read somewhere that 80% of PGA Tour Pros are front arm swingers but when I asked some friends who are better players they replied that they don't even think about it. Is this what Greg is saying?

What I am saying is that any effort to only swing with your lead arm, or only hit with your trail arm is probably going to lead you down a path that will result in poor results. I think even if you pull with your lead side its a "feel" and if you are trying to hit the ball, I mean say your trying to bust a 3 iron, your using all your muscles to do it. I used to believe you could have say a inert left arm pull and drive only your right arm, but I don't believe that anymore, the best players are not doing that. Thats why I used the baseball swing analogy.

I have no idea how that correlates to Brian's thoughts but though I would respond to your question.

 

[gmbtempe]

Pete, Brian is saying he agrees 100% with gmbtempe.

If you want to find out which arm is dominant in your swing, just grab a gallon of milk/water with both hands and fling it around your yard. Take the handle in your left hand and hold the other side with your right hand and sling it with your golf motion. Maybe you'll find one arm dominating slightly but probably not by much.

I would agree with this, you might have a preference, I am more right hand dominant in my swing, mostly likely cause my pivot sucks, but I don't think I should come with some kind of funky mechanics to fit a stronger right handed swing.

Maybe it should be just the opposite, if you seem right hand dominant in a golf swing maybe that tells you to look for the cause rather than the result?

 

[Erik_K]

Make a swing with your left arm only. You can probably only make solid contact with a wedge and if the ball goes 70 yards that's probably better than most. Trying to hit the driver, with the left arm only, takes considerable skill and practice. Having said that there are probably some very talented people who can tee it up and make a pass with the left arm and actually nail it 200+ in the fairway.

Make a swing with the right arm only. You can probably get 3/4 of the distance with the right arm only swings. I've seen people thump the ball a long way with just one arm. David Lee advocates these sorts of drills. A ways back I actually made decent contact with my 5W using a right arm only swing.

Could you train yourself to hit it better with just one arm? Say the left arm? Yes, why not? However, both arms participate and I think the roles of each arm are a little different even though they are both attached to the club.

I really don't know how to reduce the 'participation' of one arm over the other, other than taking one arm off. The one arm only drills/swings usually help foster smoother swing mechanics, better balance...a more graceful and athletic motion.

You didn't disclose very much other than stating that timing is the issue. And this could mean any number of things to different people.

 

[Keefer]

Make a swing with your left arm only. You can probably only make solid contact with a wedge and if the ball goes 70 yards that's probably better than most. Trying to hit the driver, with the left arm only, takes considerable skill and practice. Having said that there are probably some very talented people who can tee it up and make a pass with the left arm and actually nail it 200+ in the fairway.

Make a swing with the right arm only. You can probably get 3/4 of the distance with the right arm only swings. I've seen people thump the ball a long way with just one arm. David Lee advocates these sorts of drills. A ways back I actually made decent contact with my 5W using a right arm only swing.

Could you train yourself to hit it better with just one arm? Say the left arm? Yes, why not? However, both arms participate and I think the roles of each arm are a little different even though they are both attached to the club.

I really don't know how to reduce the 'participation' of one arm over the other, other than taking one arm off. The one arm only drills/swings usually help foster smoother swing mechanics, better balance...a more graceful and athletic motion.

You didn't disclose very much other than stating that timing is the issue. And this could mean any number of things to different people.

Mike Groton (long drive champion) says just the opposite. He says for power / more distance lead with the left. I've also seen John Daly practice with just hitting balls with his left arm.


Lead With Your Left | GolfTipsMag.com


Again, both arms are obviously involved, but what are the consequences when the dominant arm / hand takes over? It just makes sense that you'd swing out over the plane and out to in (steep). More errant shots.

My guess is there are PGA Tour players who would give different answers. Azinger said he tries to hit it as hard as he can with his right hand / arm. Others like Davis Love are more left arm / hand swingers.

I tend to buy into the left side lead as a more on plane swing. Harder to cast, come over the top and be too steep. Again, if your problem is any of those then the left arm lead would help IMO. If you swing too inside out then maybe you need more right arm. Everyone is different.

I'm talking about the consequences of a too dominant right arm in the swing for a right handed golfer.

 

[Erik_K]

Like I said before...to me it seems to difficult to just throttle back one arm vs the other. How do you do that? It may very well help as a swing thought, sure. Maybe if someone has a OTT move where the right shoulder is clearly spinning out early, the left arm focus could benefit. Having said that, there's more than one way to skin a cat.

An OTT move (as your article states) is rooted in the right arm tugging from the top. There are probably a dozen ways to come over the top.

Hey if it works for you as a swing thought, that's terrific. Me, I really don't buy it.

Erik

 

[JMAC81955]

I broke my right hand last summer and and played with just my left hand on the nine hole par 32 course where I live. It was really difficult.
The driver of course was the hardest part. I purchased a kid's driver that was short and whippy and I got to where I could hit it 180 yds. If I tried to swing to hard I would hit a big push. Pitching and chipping was easier and I probably putted better left handed than I putt now with two hands. My best round was 45, which I did several times.

I think Al Al Geiberger in his book tempo said he pulled the club with his left hand. I' think it takes two arms two hit the ball well, but since I'm employing the out toss and tumble it's the first time I feel like I make an athletic move with my right arm

 

[Erik_K]

I broke my right hand last summer and and played with just my left hand on the nine hole par 32 course where I live. It was really difficult.
The driver of course was the hardest part. I purchased a kid's driver that was short and whippy and I got to where I could hit it 180 yds. If I tried to swing to hard I would hit a big push. Pitching and chipping was easier and I probably putted better left handed than I putt now with two hands. My best round was 45, which I did several times.

I think Al Al Geiberger in his book tempo said he pulled the club with his left hand. I' think it takes two arms two hit the ball well, but since I'm employing the out toss and tumble it's the first time I feel like I make an athletic move with my right arm

Kevin Shields basically had to change the whole way I hit the ball. We needed to work on both sets of arms, hands, and wrists. Personally I focus on the shoulder complex and right wrist unbending near the hitting zone. I like to think I do indeed hit the ball with the right hand.

Erik

 

[Keefer]

Like I said before...to me it seems to difficult to just throttle back one arm vs the other. How do you do that? It may very well help as a swing thought, sure. Maybe if someone has a OTT move where the right shoulder is clearly spinning out early, the left arm focus could benefit. Having said that, there's more than one way to skin a cat.

An OTT move (as your article states) is rooted in the right arm tugging from the top. There are probably a dozen ways to come over the top.

Hey if it works for you as a swing thought, that's terrific. Me, I really don't buy it.

Erik

Most golfers swing out to in / steep and cut across the ball / slice. The right shoulder comes out and over and the swing plane is off right for the get-go. Ideally you'd want the left arm to lead going back and coming down (on plane) then apply the right arm / hand at impact. The swing happens so fast that's hard to do.

All the bad things that throw off the swing would seem to be eliminated with the right arm being more passive in the downswing.

 

[Virtuoso]

"It just makes sense that...." and "To me it seems...." Sometimes these statements lead to the path of enlightenment, and sometimes they lead down the path to destruction.

Not that you should abandon your instincts all together but I would definitely say a golfer needs to analyse individual movements within the context of the entire motion...lest he be doomed to have a piecemeal golf swing....specifically one that functions by one movement doing double-time to make up for an inefficiency somewhere else.

 

[Pete J]

"It just makes sense that...." and "To me it seems...." Sometimes these statements lead to the path of enlightenment, and sometimes they lead down the path to destruction.

Not that you should abandon your instincts all together but I would definitely say a golfer needs to analyse individual movements within the context of the entire motion...lest he be doomed to have a piecemeal golf swing....specifically one that functions by one movement doing double-time to make up for an inefficiency somewhere else.

Viruoso.....I asked this question of a couple of right handed Pros at a golf school at a resort near San Diego a couple of years ago. They both immediately replied that the most force/energy was coming from the ride hand/arm because they were so right hand dominant. That's why this question is so interesting......you get so many conflicting answers. Is this one of those situations where there is no right answer.......whatever works for you best is correct?

 

[conkanen]

I am a right handed person who swings left. I was a lead arm dominant golfer until the past few years until I trained my left arm/hand
swing to participate more in the swing. I have more golf dexterity in my left hand now than i do my right/lead hand and I am a much better player b/c of it. I had big time issues opening the clubface wide open on the backswing and relying on the right/lead arm/hand to square it on the downswing as my bottom/left hand was just going along for the ride. I could hit the biggest wipes you ever saw with a 9 iron.