True Swinging??

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Tball88

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In true swinging do you make any effort to square the clubface or does it happen on it's own? When I try a true "pulling motion" it is easier for me to maintain lag with the longer clubs, however, I fight a slightly open face. Ball starts straight and then fades. I recently had my driver down to about a 7 degree launch angle, which makes me wonder if I'm getting my hands a little bit too far in front and the club can't squre.

thanks
 
Bill Miracle

Bill Miracle

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On all my longer clubs....

Tball88 said:
In true swinging do you make any effort to square the clubface or does it happen on it's own? When I try a true "pulling motion" it is easier for me to maintain lag with the longer clubs, however, I fight a slightly open face. Ball starts straight and then fades. I recently had my driver down to about a 7 degree launch angle, which makes me wonder if I'm getting my hands a little bit too far in front and the club can't squre.

thanks
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I have to think about the club face turning up the plane, past impact, and left thumb under the shaft at finish to keep those fades from happening.
 
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Tball88

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Ughhh! Ok, I just realized that I was angled hinge swinging as opposed to horizontal hinging.

Two questions.1. In order not to go too far right or fade too much, what adjustment does an angled hinge swinger need to make to make sure the ball doesn't go too far right.

2. In the yellow book, when Homer said "manipulated hands swinger" I'm beginning to think he was referring to swingers who use horizontal hinging. I think most natural swingers use angled hinging into impact and then horizontal hinge post impact.

Just some random thoughts.
 
self-mastery

self-mastery

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What's a natural swinger?

Horizontal Hinging and swinging are synonymous in my book.

Swingers do not do anything consciously to square the clubface... It has taken me almost 10 years to learn what real swinging really is.... Oh what time I wasted beating impact bags and not realizing that impact isn't a static condition, but something that is flowed through...
 
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Tball88

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Self Mastery, maybe I'm wrong, but I always thought pulling and swinging were synonomous? I think you can swing with any kind of hinge motion.

When I swing, my natural tendency is to karate chop with my left hand. My arm does eventually horizontal hinge, but it's typically after the ball has left the club.

I can horizontal hinge, but for me it's a forced action.
 
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Kevin Shields

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Tball88 said:
Self Mastery, maybe I'm wrong, but I always thought pulling and swinging were synonomous? I think you can swing with any kind of hinge motion.

When I swing, my natural tendency is to karate chop with my left hand. My arm does eventually horizontal hinge, but it's typically after the ball has left the club.

I can horizontal hinge, but for me it's a forced action.
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I know this isn't a popular thought on this forum, but you should strengthen your left hand grip if the karate chop is your tendency.
 
self-mastery

self-mastery

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I guess if you are into the book, you can use any hinge action with either swinging or hitting. I tinker between pulling with the left hand only, pulling with the right forearm, and pulling with both. I produce a draw with any of those motions and HH. I think that golfers that unintentionally leak the ball RIGHT with a left hand karate chop don't make a 3d motion downplane... They don't don't go down-out-forward, instead they just go forward... MEH I spent almost 10 years going forward and leaking drives to the right. I didn't learn how to pull and use my left hand until about 8 weeks ago... now I bomb penetrating draws 290--330 (350 with my let loose pull motion).

Natural swingers know how to use their left arm and utilize HH...

This is just my opinion and my experience. Hopefully Manzella will chime in and bust our logic up with some hard facts.
 
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Tball88

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Self Mastery, I think the interesting part about your last comment was
"MEH I spent almost 10 years going forward and leaking drives to the right. I didn't learn how to pull and use my left hand until about 8 weeks ago... now I bomb penetrating draws 290--330 (350 with my let loose pull motion).

Natural swingers know how to use their left arm and utilize HH..."

If "Natural Swingers" know how to use their left arm and utilize HH, then you are a manipulated hands swinger. As you stated your natural tendency was to angle hinge into impact and leak the ball right. Through hard work and dedication you've learned how to HH into impact, which is awesome.

I think we're closer to agreeing than disagreeing. I struggle with the same problem, and have not come close to mastering HH, Angled is just a lot more natural to me.

As far as getting a stronger grip, maybe that is the answer. Worked for DD and Jack, who I believe both angled hinged.
 
self-mastery

self-mastery

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:) I think it is natural for most golfers to use a faulty technique. I think I had poor driver fundamentals as well as a crappy technique. The problem with the karate chop procedure is that most people pull it down straight to the ball.... oops look right... I wouldn't classify myself as a manipulated hands swinger... Isn't that 'affirming the consequent' or some other freshmen year Logic term I can't remember or correctly apply???
 
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Kevin Shields

Super Moderator
While I agree that this pattern has a little too much 'forward", you can still make a 3D downswing and not square the clubface. If it's not natural to rotate the face off the plane and use the back of your left hand as a 2nd clubface, I'd strengthen that hand.
 
self-mastery

self-mastery

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Always fun to chop up swing theory (the last guy I made that comment to took offense to it...) I suppose he didn't understand my use of "chop up". Meh Feminized society.....:)

I don't think it's the pattern, but the misuse of the left hand going straight down at the ball. If someone really sucks at using the karate chop pull down a strong grip most likely won't help.

Dude don't make me go outside in the cold to tinker... I already have a cold from hitting pitch shots in the rain...
 
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Tball88

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Self Mastery- Get out there and angle hinge some wedges, you'll love it. High and straight . I played today, high of 47 and misting the hole time, but the course was wide open:)

Just got to aim left with the woods.

I was watching clips of Jack today, big time angled hinge into impact and just crushed it. But he aimed left to play for it.
 
self-mastery

self-mastery

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doubled said:
We sound alot alike in that regard. It's December in Pa and i just chopped up my backyard experimenting:D
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I'm in Georgia, but if I lived in the Tundra my glacier would have divots:)

Golf at any cost...

I might be the only one on the golf course on Christmas day. Family junk then golf:)

I sneaked onto my first golf course on Thanksgiving only to find a few other nuts hacking it up as well...

TGIDNHAW- Thank God I do not have a wife!
 
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self-mastery

self-mastery

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Tball88 said:
Self Mastery- Get out there and angle hinge some wedges, you'll love it. High and straight . I played today, high of 47 and misting the hole time, but the course was wide open:)

Just got to aim left with the woods.

I was watching clips of Jack today, big time angled hinge into impact and just crushed it. But he aimed left to play for it.
Click to expand...

Noooo I refuse to tinker!!! I'm in love with my current pattern:D Offering me that tip is like offering an alcoholic just one sip:(

My tinkering hasn't been detrimental with this pattern... Just adding and removing components.

Staying steadfast and on the left side of the course!

I just got through angle hinging my wedge with a foam ball with a strong grip... I like it! Hitterish without all that nonsense.
 
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self-mastery

self-mastery

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I just moved back to Alpharetta.

I have a Canton story involving the police, mistaken identity, an underaged girl and her mother.

If we ever meet in person I would have to tell you it!
 
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