What does the hole in my glove tell me?

[birly-shirly]

I know, I know - other than that I need a new glove.

I started wearing a left hand glove for the first time in years this summer. Relatively quickly, I wore a hole in the thumb - immediately below the crease of the joint nearest the end of my thumb.

This is the same spot that tends to blister if I hit too many balls without a glove.

So I guess there must be some slippage under my thumb during the swing. Actually, I know there is. In my downswing, the handle tends to slip a little away from my left thumb, either that or my thumb slips a little towards the butt end of the club.

Any suggestions then? e.g.

Is this common?

Is it the cause of my hook?

Should I try to grip more firmly with my left thumb?

Should I hold the club more deeply in the palm of my left hand? (my normal grip is very much along the roots of the middle to little fingers and the spot that slips is pretty much the only part of my thumb or thumb pad that makes firm contact with the handle)

Am I raising the handle too much through impact?

Thanks for any ideas.

 

[natep]

I wear holes in the same spot. I know my thumb slips slightly toward the clubhead at the top of my backswing.

 

[softconsult]

Remember that the right hand could be contributing to the problem, if it's not
doing it's part to support the club at the end of the backswing.

 

[natep]

Yeah that's probably part of my problem. I'm left handed but play right handed so my right hand is pretty weak.

 

[Shot Limit]

I think the more that grip slips into the middle of the left hand, the more pressure you instinctively apply with your thumb. Maybe the grip is not under the heel pad enough forcing you to add more thumb.

 

[joep]

Your problem is that your not gripping the club with your FINGERS with the fat (bottom) part of your thumb on top of your handle. Mike Jacobs has the best tip I had in golf. Take the club with your left hand only pull the club straight back by your side till its behind you. Your hand will auotomatically grip the club proper with the fingers gripping the club qnd the fat part of your thumb will be on top of the club. How I know this I had this problem for years and now doing it right no more holes in glove and playing much better....I am now out of the hole in the glove gang.

 

[savydan]

Remember that the right hand could be contributing to the problem, if it's not
doing it's part to support the club at the end of the backswing.

Agree.

 

[softconsult]

Like a lot of things in golf, one size doesn't fit all. Handsize
and finger length come into play. I wear a size large glove,
have long fingers, and play with 1/32nd over grips.
I broke my left thumb between the wrist joint and first thumb
joint during high school boxing class.

There are grip methods called long thumb and short thumb. The
longer you extend the left thumb down the shaft, the more you
can cock your wrist and the more the thumb pad lays on the grip.
If I use the long thumb, it eventually hurts where the break was.
So I use short thumb, and my left thumb pad really never touches
the grip. However, I have never experienced any particular wear under the
left thumb.

Also worn grips, old grips, or incorrectly sized grips could contribute to thumb
slippage.

 

[lookingtolearn]

How "long" is your left thumb and is it more on top of the shaft or more to the right?

 

[birly-shirly]

Thanks to everyone for the feedback so far.

To try and answer some of the questions:

I have small to medium sized hands. A good match to Jack N's if the silhouettes in Golf My Way are anything to go by.

It's hard to quantify short or long left thumb - but I'd guess medium to short, in that I could easily set it longer. Then again, I think the slippage effectively makes it shorter.

Long or short, my thumb is definitely set right of centre on the handle.

I know that the slip happens near the bottom of my downswing, and that my thumb slips towards the butt end. Possibly, I'll need to check, it's slipping in the other direction at the top of the swing - although I've not been conscious of that happening.

I agree generally though with the issue of both hands working together, especially at the top. I like and use the tip of holding a coin or something small between the right thumb pad and the left thumb.

I really don't think though that the club is either too much in the palm or slipping there during the swing. I'd say my left hand grip is very much in the fingers. One reason for posting this was that I wondered whether more of a palm grip would be more secure. I certainly get more contact area between my thumb and the handle with the club more in the palm. My normal grip seems to have quite a bit of airspace under my thumb.

JoeP - where were your holes in your glove before Mike's tip fixed you up? Also, I would say that my left hand grip is between my fingers and the heel pad, not my thumb pad. If your pressure on the top of the handle is coming from your thumb pad, then I think your grip is quite a bit more in the palm than mine. Just curious to see what has worked for you.

Thanks for all the help so far.

 

[Matt Bryda]

birly-shirly,

Maybe the grip is not under the heel pad enough forcing you to add more thumb.

I think shot limit has it right.

I wore out many many gloves in the exact same spot of my left hand thumb, even blistered the thumb and beyond that to where the skin would just tear away, slow learner I guess.

Kevin showed me how to get my left hand on more with the heel pad on top, I thought I had there until I asked him.

But the big reason that contributed to my left hand thumb issue was being underplane, my only thought from the top of the backswing was pull almost as hard as I could with zero right arm assist. I would hit the ugliest half lateral/pitch out short right shots you ever saw, like a yip pitch. I ended up with high hands and a low club at the wrong time of the swing, impact, instead of the finish.

So after a couple of lessons with Brian and a long lesson with Kevin I am finally understanding how much pull and push I need to not be so far underplane.

I hope this helps.

Matt

 

[Kevin Shields]

Do you have curved thumbs, birly?

 

[birly-shirly]

birly-shirly,



I think shot limit has it right.

I wore out many many gloves in the exact same spot of my left hand thumb, even blistered the thumb and beyond that to where the skin would just tear away, slow learner I guess.

Kevin showed me how to get my left hand on more with the heel pad on top, I thought I had there until I asked him.

But the big reason that contributed to my left hand thumb issue was being underplane, my only thought from the top of the backswing was pull almost as hard as I could with zero right arm assist. I would hit the ugliest half lateral/pitch out short right shots you ever saw, like a yip pitch. I ended up with high hands and a low club at the wrong time of the swing, impact, instead of the finish.

So after a couple of lessons with Brian and a long lesson with Kevin I am finally understanding how much pull and push I need to not be so far underplane.

I hope this helps.

Matt

Thanks Matt - where was your grip before, and after Kevin's lesson? What changed for you? I don't think my left hand is a palm grip at all - but now I'm worried that you thought the same thing and still had to make the change.

The heel of my hand, from the wrist to the "heart line" (I had to look up a palmistry page!) is pressuring down on the top half of the handle. I think, if I moved the grip any more into the fingers, I would have nearly a 4 knuckle strong grip.

I like your thoughts about getting underplane. I know my swing path tends to go inside out, and I already suspected that my thumb is slipping as a result of my left wrist over-extending (ulnar deviation) as I come into the ball.

I've made good progress this year in straightening out my club path. I wonder whether a focus on lower hands through impact would make a good complementary fix?

Cheers

 

[birly-shirly]

Do you have curved thumbs, birly?

Kevin - yes, I probably do. I don't know what counts as "normal" - but the back of my thumb from knuckle to nail certainly isn't straight. Nail is probably at 45* to first joint.

 

[softconsult]

Pretty interesting. Never heard of curved thumbs.

Problem description is a challenge. Three thoughts.

Birly, saying your left thumb is definitely to the right
needs a further description. Tell us how far to the right
using the clockface technique.

Nail at 45 degrees. Which direction? Convex or concave?

What would be fun is for you to take some stills of your
grip and post them. I'll bet you actually get solid suggestions.

I've said it before, but Brian spent at least 30 minutes on my
grip, which wasn't too bad to start with. Over and over, emphasizing
exactly the steps to get it right.

 

[birly-shirly]

Pretty interesting. Never heard of curved thumbs.

Problem description is a challenge. Three thoughts.

Birly, saying your left thumb is definitely to the right
needs a further description. Tell us how far to the right
using the clockface technique.

Nail at 45 degrees. Which direction? Convex or concave?

What would be fun is for you to take some stills of your
grip and post them. I'll bet you actually get solid suggestions.

I've said it before, but Brian spent at least 30 minutes on my
grip, which wasn't too bad to start with. Over and over, emphasizing
exactly the steps to get it right.

Well there you go. I said I didn't know what counted as a normal thumb, and now I might be about to find out.

My thumb bends back concave from knuckle to nail. That's where I see a roughly 45* angle. Can't you bend your thumb back beyond straight? Oh, and are your thumbs normal?

My thumb is on the handle at about 1 o'clock.

Cheers
BS

 

[softconsult]

I was reacting to Kevin's curved thumb question.

Your thumb seems perfectly normal to me and the one o'clock
position sounds just right. The thumb position thing was to
eliminate the possibility of some really strong thumb position.
Yeah, when I bend my thumb it's about 45 degrees.

Kevin, what is a curved thumb?

 

[mgranato]

Curved:

Straight:

[media]http://thesituationist.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/thumbs-up.jpg[/media]

There's a theory/observation that the best of athletes have curved thumbs. Jack's are quite curved. I remember him commenting about it being an advantage for golf - who knows?

 

[softconsult]

Never heard of that concept.

Did the test. I have curved thumbs.
What a jock!

 

[Matt Bryda]

birly=shirly,

Thanks Matt - where was your grip before, and after Kevin's lesson? What changed for you?

Before the lesson I had the club diagonally across the left hand close to the base of the fingers. I thought this was actually a stronger grip until Kevin suggested a slightly stronger grip. Actually after working with it for a couple of months it finally fit in with what I was trying to do with my downswing (tumble). 7 months later after working on a lower hands feel into delivery the sequencing of the downswing is much improved or at least I am more aware of it. I have to wait a little for the hands/arms vertical drop instead of just pulling as hard as I can from the top.

So now I am to the point of not trying for low hands through impact I'm striving for the clubhead back on the ball side of a line between the ball and the toes for irons. Driver is a different story.

My thumb is on the handle at about 1 o'clock.

My thumb was always in this position so this was not the issue with me. I think it is more about the hand relationship with the handle of the club (stretched diagonally or more like a fist). For me more like a fist actually encourages more down pressure with the left thumb. Before this change I never had any downward pressure with the left thumb on the handle and I think this is the key.
It's kind of like Brian describing the left thumb on the club by making a thumb print. I took that as making a thumb print and then being able to pull the thumb off the club very easily. I don't think this was his point. Now once I get the left hand fingers/base of hand on the club the pressure was created by more of a fist position (not stretched so far down the club) and the thumb is forced down more.
Hope this can help you.

Matt