lookingtolearn
New
Does anyone have any suggestions for a good laser training aid (or something similar) to help with putting aim? There seems to be quite a few on the market.
Thanks.
Thanks.
Best training aid for putter alignment?
- Thread starter lookingtolearn
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Richie3Jack
New
I use the LPAS (Laser Putting Alignment System). It's a good aid, but the double side tape you use to attach the laser to putter is a real pain in the arse and it can lose its adhesiveness pretty quickly.
I think the very best is some type of laser aid that David Edel uses with his putter fittings, where they shoot the laser from the cup at the putter face and then it reflects and shows where you're aiming. But I think that's pretty expensive.
YAKUZA
I think the very best is some type of laser aid that David Edel uses with his putter fittings, where they shoot the laser from the cup at the putter face and then it reflects and shows where you're aiming. But I think that's pretty expensive.
YAKUZA
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
I dont mean to dump on training aids but isnt the best alignment aid a sharpie and a line on your putter? I mean, how easy is that? Line up the sharpie line on your ball to the target and put your putter down in line with the line on the ball. Tell me what I'm missing?
Plus, you can do it on the course which you cant with a laser.
Plus, you can do it on the course which you cant with a laser.
ggsjpc
New
I'm a ball line user but I understand it's limitations.
Getting the line straight on the ball-easily overcome
Getting the line on the absolute top of the ball on the ground-not easy, especially with an non pure surface to rest the ball on.
Actually aiming that line where you want-You wouldn't think it's as hard as it is.
Lining up your putter square to the line(matching lines up, etc...)-Again not as easy as you think.
Even with all this chance for error, I still think it helps me.
lookingtolearn
New
I think there have been studies done that show that it doesn't help much. I believe Brian mentioned this as well in a post a while back.
Richie3Jack
New
According to studies done the line on the ball (or using a sharpie line) doesn't really help much with aim, particularly once you get outside of 5 feet.
I believe it.
If you are very poor at mis-aligning with the putter, you may be a little better using the line on the ball because you can stand behind the ball (as opposed to standing beside the ball when you putt), but there is still a very likely error to happen.
I used to think differently until I became aware of this and then when I used my laser aid it showed the same thing, slight improvement, but still inaccurate aiming.
Plus, I think it hurts your feel and instincts a bit.
What improved my aiming the most? Understanding 'the geometry of a breaking putt.'
I think in my case what was happening was I had been aiming a breaking putt at the apex of the curve instead of above the curve. Then when I missed putt, my brain would try to compensate for it and it would throw my aim off.
It's funny, once I started to understand that, I used my laser aid and my aim was entirely better without even trying.
3JACK
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Damon Lucas
Super Moderator
Kevin,
I use a line on the ball, but the reasons it does not work for a lot of people are...
People don't put the ball down such that the line is perpendicular to the surface(they do it to gravity),
They look down their cheeks at the ball,
They have their eyes inside the line of the ball,
Their heads/throat lines are not in line with the putter face
They don't aim the line in the intended direction - carelessness
Their targeting and aiming proceedures are sub standard
Or a combination of the above!
TROYNYGOLFER
New
DUH!!!! Four years of college, majored in a science, and I never gave this a thought.
Kevin Shields
Super Moderator
I asked for it!
I asked what I was missing, and I got it! All good points, I guess. Once my eyes adjusted to the line, ive never putted better so I'll save some money on laser trainers but if they work for someone great.
I asked what I was missing, and I got it! All good points, I guess. Once my eyes adjusted to the line, ive never putted better so I'll save some money on laser trainers but if they work for someone great.
benhogan55
New
How do you know how far above the apex of the break to aim?
Richie3Jack
New
For the most part, you're supposed to aim 2.5 times above the apex. So let's say a putt has a one foot break. You need to aim 2 1/2 feet above the apex. For super fast greens, aim further above. For very slow greens aim less above the apex. But the majority of the time it's 2.5 times above.
3JACK
Damon Lucas
Super Moderator
Richie,
Please tell me you're smarter than this?
Back this up with with something ..... anything?
Richie3Jack
New
ZAP
New
The apex is a relative term is it not? On a breaking putt the farthest to the side of the hole that the ball will be is when it leaves the putter relative to the original line. After impact it is headed towards the hole off that original line the entire way.
I have to vote for the Pelz putting tutor as an alignment aid. I was very surprised at how bad I was at aiming. What I used to do was block the ball on to a line. When I tried putting down the back side of a 6 foot straight edge I could not keep the ball on it.
I have to vote for the Pelz putting tutor as an alignment aid. I was very surprised at how bad I was at aiming. What I used to do was block the ball on to a line. When I tried putting down the back side of a 6 foot straight edge I could not keep the ball on it.
Damon Lucas
Super Moderator
So Damon, do you disagree with this graph?
3JACK
There is a difference between high point and apex.....so what?
Are you carrying that graph onto the putting green?
Putting the high point versus the apex according to ANY graph is NOT the way to learn how to aim, IMO.
It's like saying aim 7% more left when there is a 18 mile per hour wind.
How do you know whether you aim well or hit it where you aim?
Richie3Jack
New
Damon,
Provided you're on a planar slope, can find the fall line, and are 5-20 feet from the cup, there are charts that you can use to tell you exactly where to aim. And it's becoming more and more popular on the PGA Tour.
So yeah, you can take that graph onto the putting green in a sense.
And if I'm reading a 1 foot break, how hard is it to say 'hey, you need to aim about 2 1/2 feet up?'
Furthermore, if you use the chart, which are various charts depending on the % of slope and stimp and you have the stimp you can get a pretty good idea of how well you aim. If the speed is good and you have the stimp and slope % pretty well approximated and you miss a left to right putt up high...well, it's not hard to deduct that you probably aimed too far left.
It's not about certainty, but more about probability and being able to do a little bit of adjusting if needed.
3JACK
ggsjpc
New
What is the difference between high point and apex? I thought they were the same.
I didn't think Richie was saying that by aiming above the apex he is improving the learning of how to aim. I thought he was just talking about where to aim.
I agree with Ritchie. If you aim at the apex or the top point of a curve on a breaking putt you will most of the time end up below the hole, why? because the ground on the inside of the putts apex point is sloped away from that apex point. So by the time the ball nears the apex it has already started to break away from the apex and will miss the hole on the low side.
The only way to overcome this is to hit the putt so hard it takes almost no break but is travelling so fast it can't go in the hole. All this isn't even accounting for the direction of grain of the grass, so add that in there also. Therefore the idea is you have more chance to make the putt coming from this side of it than been below the hole where you have no chance.
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Richie3Jack
New
Actually John, I am saying that. Not that my aim is flawless, but it has improved when I have used the Laser aid to check on my aim.
It's apparent to me that Damon hasn't been educated on the subject. Because you can, to a degree 'take the graph' out on the green to you with the aim charts. And it's not too hard to figure out if you read the break, and you're supposed to aim about 2.5 times above the apex, then to calculate about where you aim.
But as far as improving my aim, it's not that hard of a concept to grasp. In the past when I would aim at the apex, it's quite conceivable that I would tend to miss on the low side and then make compensations for that. I used to be very aggressive with my speed which curbs the amount of break. Just a compensation being made for a flaw.
I think the big thing that happened to me, and I believe this is very much true with other golfers that aim at the apex, is that when you aim there and miss it low, the brain tells you 'hey, I have to play more break.' I think that completely disturbs things. Then you start making stroke, aim and speed compensations.
Put it this way, let's say I have everything pretty accurate according to the aim chart (stimp, slope, fall line position, putt speed, etc) and I miss a leftward breaking putt on the high side, then I know that I most certainly aimed too far to the right. So not only do I find the aim charts invaluable for helping make more putts, but I find that the feedback it provides invaluable for improving one's aim.
3JACK
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