Carl Wolter - Long Drive Champ

[OLIVER1]

We recently had Carl Wolter, the long-drive champ, at our place hitting shots for an outing...Phew, talk about impressive. He was hitting it about 360 yards average CARRY slightly uphill into a teeny breeze with a 46" driver, triple XXX shaft with no grooves on the face. I got to spend about 20 minutes alone with him and peppered him with technique/Trackman questions.

His AoA is about + 6 degrees. Clubhead speed maxed out is about 147mph (unless he throttles back and drops to a rather more manageable 138 mph!) Ball speed is in the low 200's. Optimal launch for him is about 14 degrees and optimal spin rate is about 2100rpms. He said that even a whiff of a groove on his driver would, at those speeds, send his spin rate into the stratosphere. He also said something very interesting: That the driver faces of he and his long-hitting brethren are not pushed to their CT/COR limit, because at that ball speed there is a diminishing rate of returns. Alas, I lacked the foresight to follow up with him on it.

He mentioned that Jamie Sadlowski has slightly higher club and ball speeds at impact, but that his ball speed as it approaches the ground is waaay faster than Jamies, and thus he hits it further. Apparently, Titleist are currently trying to figure out why that is ( I assume it's something to do with the way the spin changes as it nears the end of its flight, but that's just me guessing)

His clubs were made by KRANK (never heard of them)and the lofts on them varied between 4 and 7 degrees. Shafts were all Fujikuras - although I doubt you could buy them at Golf Galaxy

As to his technique, he was working on the firing of the lower right leg (he's a righty) and was keen to tell me about how a lot of the new research shows the upper-body pivot wheeling backwards in a very PARTICULAR FASHION, (hula-hoop out of the ground, going normal like crazy, anyone?) and wouldn't you know we got interrupted before I could pounce on that juicy tidbit.

I've never seen a ball literally driven out of sight before seeing Carl, but now I have and it was quite something. I stood as close to him as I dared for at least 7 or 8 shots, trying to watch his technique but it takes a while to decouple yourself from the awe factor and put your sober, sensible golf pro head on again.

I forgot to mention that he's about 6'5", of very broad build and could probably wang me 200 yards down the fairway. He is also an exceedingly nice chap and very giving of his time to anybody who wanted to ask questions. He's well worth a gander if anybody gets the chance...

 

[hp12c]

Wow!

 

[cwdlaw223]

These people are unreal. I'm not convinced that most people (99%) can be taught to get clubhead speed over 130+. There are many biomechanical components in play to generate such speed and 130+ is simply incredible. 147? Out of this world. Sort of like professional NFL football players. There aren't that many walking on this planet when compared to the total population. Freaks.

 

[OLIVER1]

cwd, Thanks for that video clip. And you know the odd thing? He wasn't swinging nearly that hard the other day (At least his feet weren't coming off the ground as in the clip)
If anybody has any insight, I'd be fascinated to know as to why their clubs aren't maxed out, and that ball speed on descent thing is also a puzzler

 

[Scott P]

A kid that used to work for me finished 4th last year at the finals. His swing speed was 157 and balls speeds were in the 230's on extremely well hit balls. When he first came to me I fit him for a driver, his swing speed topped out at 130. He then decided he wanted to start doing long driver events and managed to increase his swing speed well in to the 150's. It's pretty awesome to watch him destroy a golf ball.

 

[bryan@nobackswing.com]

great writeup, thanks Oliver.

 

[natep]

I'd be fascinated to know as to why their clubs aren't maxed out

Do you mean maxed out for COR?

Those guys need a thicker than standard face or they'll just cave it in. I remember reading how Sadlowski will cave in a stock driver after just a few balls.

 

[OLIVER1]

Do you mean maxed out for COR?

Those guys need a thicker than standard face or they'll just cave it in. I remember reading how Sadlowski will cave in a stock driver after just a few balls.

Ah, Nate. That's where I was hoping you guys would be able to fill in the blanks for me... It's very interesting, but I'm just not tech-savvy enough to be able to write about it with any authority...Sorry.

 

[StevePratt]

The part where he said Jamie had faster initial ball speed but not as fast at landing really intrigues me.

This was apparent at Mesquite, and a focused eye can see the difference in the ball flight. My theory is that it comes down to spin and landing angle.

I believe Carl gets more than most out of his efforts because he is landing at a more optimal angle for the conditions. While many people write Carl off last year as just getting some lucky bounces on dry spots in the grid, I wonder if there was something more to it...

On my Trackman, drives of around 37-38 degrees landing go the farthest. I lose around 15-20 yards as soon as I start landing in the 42-43 range. But this can be taken care of with equipment and technique, not luck.

 

[Ringer]

Seems simple really. Higher speeds have more drag. At some point the drag outweighs the aerodynamics of lift through the Bernouilli principle.

 

[mgranato]

Do you mean maxed out for COR?

Those guys need a thicker than standard face or they'll just cave it in. I remember reading how Sadlowski will cave in a stock driver after just a few balls.

You beat me to it.

It's also why a lot of these guys (and the boutique club makers they use) are really big on cup face designed heads - typically much stronger than face welded heads.

O1, did he hit any other clubs for you guys?

 

[OLIVER1]

You beat me to it.

It's also why a lot of these guys (and the boutique club makers they use) are really big on cup face designed heads - typically much stronger than face welded heads.

O1, did he hit any other clubs for you guys?

Yes, the heads were a very strange shape. I'm struggling to put into words how they looked - Almost like a combination of the bog-standard, common-or-garden look and something quite futuristic.

Mike, He hit a Taylor Made Rossa putter about 280 yards, that, by all accounts was the prettiest drive you've ever seen (I wasn't there for that, but my colleagues assured me it was a gorgeous little bid with the flatstick.) He also had one of those supper-whippy training aids that he made mincemeat of to the tune of, oh, I don't know, 280 yards or so.

He also battered his way through enough plywood to keep Home Depot going for a few months, and walloped a tiny little training club - probably smaller than a kid's size club - that scorched the atmosphere a few times (Again, I wasn't there for that last one)

He said any number of very interesting things, usually in relation to tour pros, and, as I remember them, I'll just add to this thread. My memory is shot away for the most part, but I'll do my best.

All in all, he was great value, and a great lad to boot.

 

[Tony D'Antonio]

Funny this thread should pop up. I don't know much about the long drive guys but I helped out at an American Cancer Society golf event Monday at Olympic Club and a nice young man named Ryan Winther was there to put on long drive displays and hit drives for groups in their "shamble" rounds. I'm sorry to say I didn't get to see him hit one ball but I did make friends with his agent (friend) and we hit it off so well we may be playing a round or two in the future. I can't wait to pound my drive 250. Supposedly Ryan hits his 5 iron that far. I googled Ryan Winther and he generates massive clubhead speed and he definitely is not dragging anything to impact. Ryan also uses Krank drivers and apparently has to bring plenty of them to events. He crushes the face on those regularly. Funny, in 40 years of golf I've never seen anyone ruin a driver by hitting it too hard. Amazing. I'll report back with more info if I get to play a round with Ryan.

 

[Virtuoso]

Seems simple really. Higher speeds have more drag. At some point the drag outweighs the aerodynamics of lift through the Bernouilli principle.

It doesn't seem that simple to me, can you explain in more detail what you mean? Are you saying that the drag/lift ratio is steepening the terminal angle into the ground? When you say "at some point".......at what point?

What about cover geometry and how that effects the coeficient of lift as the spin degrades?

Are you saying that the drag/lift ratio has an actual effect on ball velocity late in the flight?

As the spin degrades, is there a benefit to roll? Or does the first bounce degrade the spin completely?

Ignoring how much spin effects lift, terminal angle and roll, what effect does it have on just velocity itself?

 

[mgranato]

It doesn't seem that simple to me, can you explain in more detail what you mean? Are you saying that the drag/lift ratio is steepening the terminal angle into the ground? When you say "at some point".......at what point?

What about cover geometry and how that effects the coeficient of lift as the spin degrades?

Are you saying that the drag/lift ratio has an actual effect on ball velocity late in the flight?

As the spin degrades, is there a benefit to roll? Or does the first bounce degrade the spin completely?

Ignoring how much spin effects lift, terminal angle and roll, what effect does it have on just velocity itself?

 

[Kevin Shields]

Seems simple really. Higher speeds have more drag. At some point the drag outweighs the aerodynamics of lift through the Bernouilli principle.

"Whoa! Check out the big brain on Brett!" - Jules


What in the holy f#%€ is the Bernouilli principle?

 

[Burner]

"Whoa! Check out the big brain on Brett!" - Jules

What in the holy f#%€ is the Bernouilli principle?

At the risk of stealing Ringers thunder, read this:-

The Purpose Of Dimples

 

[StevePratt]

I played a scramble with Ryan Winther where he hit a smooth easy 9 iron to a 193 yard par 3. The ball went so high I had enough time to watch it and then exclaim, 'where is that even going to come down?'

It was so high I lost all depth perception - I was expecting it to either fly the green or come up way short. It ended up 6 feet.

Carl is a big strong guy with great technique, and probably gets overlooked because he doesn't play a lot of events and doesn't overhype himself.

 

[leon]

At the risk of stealing Ringers thunder, read this:-

The Purpose Of Dimples

Thanks for the link, a fair overview of the Magnus effect. I also seem to recall reading that dimples help to establish a turbulent boundary layer, rather than laminar, which can significantly reduce drag. But I could be wrong and my fluid dynamics is pretty sketchy.

I'm fairly sure some of this is in a book by Daish, which Brian had mentioned a few times before. Think its quite rare though.

 

[dbl]

Turbulent boundary layers FTW. However, the dimples themselves may not just be preventing laminar boundary layer but enhancing non-optimal boundary layer flow that exist without the dimples.

The Secret of Golf Balls Revealed: Dimple Dynamics - YouTube

The optimized turbulent air sticks to the ball more than without the dimples, and with the air sticking near the ball surface further around the ball there is less drag.