Cure this golfer.

[birdie_man]

It helps me to stick my butt out too vj. Leo (tongzilla) makes fun of me. )) And def. have had success with weight on heels.

"You need to stick your ass out a little more Mr. President." -Sam Snead to (I think) Eisenhower

 

[ej20]

Richie3jack,

I am not talking about individual cases here.I am talking numbers.I have watched and studied plenty of swings and the majority of good strikers are thereabouts on plane(good plane).They might be a little flat but great players with very flat backswings are few and far between.If anything my opinion is that better players tend to err on the upright side.

Nicklaus said an upright backswing doesn't require as much forearm rotation.I agree with him.

Uprightish backswings don't need twistaway.It's done for them.

 

[Richie3Jack]

Richie3jack,

I am not talking about individual cases here.I am talking numbers.I have watched and studied plenty of swings and the majority of good strikers are thereabouts on plane(good plane).They might be a little flat but great players with very flat backswings are few and far between.If anything my opinion is that better players tend to err on the upright side.

Nicklaus said an upright backswing doesn't require as much forearm rotation.I agree with him.

Uprightish backswings don't need twistaway.It's done for them.

The thread is about 'how would you cure this golfer.' I cannot go by the numbers, I need to figure out what works for this particular golfer and what does not work for a particular golfer. I think when people work from an upright plane they are getting into a dangerous territory because they are more likely IMO to come over the top. I'd rather see a golfer be a bit under plane than above the plane.





3JACK

 

[ej20]

I don't know how you can cure someone without actually seeing the swing.A description don't suffice because it could have been described incorrectly.

Some people see Hogan with a flat backswing but he's not.He is pretty much dead on plane.

You can come OTT with any backswing,not just an upright one.We will have to agree to disagree here but I think you are more likely to come OTT with a flat backswing.You need to come over the top slightly to get back on plane and thats not the downswing shape you want unless done deliberately.Now that is entering dangerous territory.

The vast majority of OTT hacks have flat backswings.I go by empirical evidence.

 

[Richie3Jack]

If you're working from the TSP instead of the elbow plane, there's a much greater chance of coming OTT, trust me...I know this full well. Now, I wouldn't suggest a natural TSP golfer try to go to the elbow plane, but it gets a bit dangerous from the TSP. A basic example is when you're playing from a lie with the ball well above your feet. Your swing flattens out a great deal and it's very difficult to come over the top. Conversely, with a lie well above your feet, your swing becomes more upright and it's almost impossible to get under plane.




3JACK

 

[ej20]

3JACK...I have posted swings in another thread where it shows so called natural TSP players are really just late shifting to the elbow plane.I don't know many pro players who's stock downswing is straight down the TSP.

Most good players downswing plane is below that of the backswing plane,not the other way around.

Of course you can still play great golf with an outside loop.Craig Parry does this but this type of swing shape is rare amongst great players.

 

[Richie3Jack]

3JACK...I have posted swings in another thread where it shows so called natural TSP players are really just late shifting to the elbow plane.I don't know many pro players who's stock downswing is straight down the TSP.

Most good players downswing plane is below that of the backswing plane,not the other way around.

Of course you can still play great golf with an outside loop.Craig Parry does this but this type of swing shape is rare amongst great players.

Nicklaus played off the TSP:

I'm pretty sure Watson did as well, but I don't have any DTL photos of his swing on me. And I believe Adam Scott uses the TSP as well on the downswing. Zach Johnson as well.

Generally I also find the Tour players operate from the elbow plane on the downwing, but I also find that often times, the backswing has little effect on whether or not they use the elbow plane or the TSP.



3JACK

 

[ej20]

Nelson is swinging a driver whereas Nicklaus is swinging a short iron.

Nicklaus shallows the club very late so that pic proves nothing.A couple more frames later he could be much shallower.

Using stills doesn't show if a player is shallowing the plane,coming straight down the plane, or coming over the plane.

 

[ej20]

And I take it back that Craig Parry has a single shift swing.He shallows late as well....extremely late.

He takes it back very flat,comes over the top on the transition and then late shifts onto the elbow plane.Extraordinary swing.


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[vjsinger]

Nelson is swinging a driver whereas Nicklaus is swinging a short iron.

Nicklaus shallows the club very late so that pic proves nothing.A couple more frames later he could be much shallower.

Using stills doesn't show if a player is shallowing the plane,coming straight down the plane, or coming over the plane.

This is true..Nicklaus shifts late because of his later leg drive.

 

[ej20]

At regular speed it looks like Parry single shifts.Only in slow mo can you see the club shallow late.