D Plane and Old PGA Ball Flight Laws (and a 250 definition of the D-Plane by BManz)

[Jared Willerson]

Yesterday, I pulled a 4 wood into some trees (the old dive move at the ball creeps in every so often) Remembering the D-plane pic from this site, I set the club and my body to hit a draw according to the D-plane....what happened was a beautiful low draw around the tree and on the green from 175 yards.

If I had used the old ball flight laws, I would have hit a tree dead solid or would have had to rely on luck.

Wow....the D-plane is boss, shot shaping is much easier now with the understanding of this concept. No more guess work.

Thanks to everyone on here who helped us understand this concept.

 

[curtisj76]

Good going Coach.

One of these days I'm gonna sit down and read up on the D-plane. I have access to Jorgensen's book, hopefully you can sit down and read it front to back, unlike that little yellow one. It's funny, I'm basically a 4.0 accounting/finance double major and what seems to be a simple concept gives me trouble. Oh well, I'll figure it out one day and hopefully it will have a positive impact to my game.

 

[Shot Limit]

I'm with you curtis.

I'm still not sure what this D-plane is all about. I mean, I've seen the pictures and everything seems Greek to me.

 

[ggsjpc]

Simplification:

Ball starts on the line the clubface is pointing when it hits the ball. If the path of the club head is to the right of the direction the face is pointing you get a draw. If the path is to the left of the direction the face is pointing you get a fade.

The larger the difference the more curve(assuming good contact).

 

[Lefty32]

With my understanding of the real ball flight laws, is it correct that you cannot not hit a fade (that starts mainly straight at the target then fades) coming from an inside to square path? Am I getting this right? In order for the face to be open to the club path (coming from the inside, causing a fade) the face would be waay open to the target and hence would start rightish and fade even more right. Is that correct? So the only way to hit a fade that starts straightish and then fades is to adjust the path more out to in? Am I getting this right or wrong? Thanks for the help.

 

[Brian Manzella]

Just a quickie....

With my understanding of the real ball flight laws, is it correct that you cannot not hit a fade (that starts mainly straight at the target then fades) coming from an inside to square path?

Not even close.

OK...

I will try to explain the D-Plane (The BALL FLIGHT Plane) in 250 words:

The clubhead is traveling up, down, or level; in, out, or straight, at impact. It does this while it is also traveling on a plane—the swing plane.

(Please do not confuse the D-Plane with the "Swing Plane," because a ball would still fly the same with only a one-inch linear clubhead movement, still on the "D-Plane.")

While the ball is being contacted by the clubface, that clubface is pointing upward (loft) sideward (lie angle+loft) right of the target (open), left of the target (closed), or at the target (square).

This D-Plane consists of three points: the ball, the direction the face is pointing (ala, lie angle tool) and the direction the clubhead is traveling at impact.

Since the ball is on the ground most of the time, golfers commonly hit down on the ball. About 6° with a lofted wedge, and about 3° with long clubs. Since the clubhead is itself traveling down a plane to get to the ball, it is also moving downward, forward, and most importantly outward at impact on shots being hit on the way down.

So....

The "bottom of the D-Plane" is the TRUE PATH of the clubhead in 3D space—starting from the ball—at impact.

The "top of the D-Plane" is the TRUE CLUBFACE "point"—like the lie angle tool—starting from the ball—at impact.

The ball itself, travels UP this D-Plane, starting about 70-85% toward the TRUE CLUBFACE POINT, and curves toward that point, on the D-Plane, until gravity, wind or whatever, changes the flight.​

So if you set-up square, and swung perfectly on a plane, that had its base (the plane line) perfectly pointing to the target, and the face was square, you'd miss the target wide left.

You can hit a fade with this alignment, with a very open clubface.

The ball would start WAY, WAY right, and curve further that way.

 

[fronesis]

So if you set-up square, and swung perfectly on a plane, that had its base (the plane line) perfectly pointing to the target, and the face was square, you'd miss the target wide left.

And this is because the clubhead is travelling down and OUT at impact, so if the face is square to the target line at impact the ball will start at the target but it will move left.

Is that correct?

 

[Lefty32]

So if you set-up square, and swung perfectly on a plane, that had its base (the plane line) perfectly pointing to the target, and the face was square, you'd miss the target wide left.

I'm not sure why I totally get this (quoted) but can't visualize the D-plane. I think it has a lot to do with my inferior spatial reasoning skills. Thanks for the explanation.

But, I think my post was poorly communicated on my part because what I was thinking was in agreement with what you explained at the end of your post. So let me try again, if your base/plane line was perfectly pointed to the target and you swung on plane, you could not hit a fade that started toward the target (straight) and then faded because if the face was square it goes left (as you said) if the face is open it starts right and goes righter. Would you have to adjust your plane line (swing path more out to in) to hit a shot that starts straight at the target and then fades?? Sorry if I keep screwing this up.

 

[Shot Limit]

Gotcha Brian,

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[jimmyt]

Was doing fine until...........

Brian Quotes:

So if you set-up square, and swung perfectly on a plane, that had its base
(the plane line) perfectly pointing to the target, and the face was square, you'd miss the target wide left.


I thought that the whole D-Plane thing was that you aimed left because the ball naturally with a good swing would start right??????So how does the above happen? Why is it moving WIDE left?????

Help......

 

[Bonesy]

I'm with Jimmy. Why way left?

 

[Tom Bartlett]

Because the clubface is square to the target at impact and the club head path is to the right imparting hook spin.

picture your roof(assuming you don't have a flat roof). The gutter is the plane line and the roof is the plane angle. If you roll a ball straight down off of your roof it will go across the gutter and out in front of your house. That is the downward part of the swing. The more downward there is the further right the true club path is from the plane your swinging on. As long as the ball rolls down the roof any amount it will cross the gutter and go out to right field. So...if the clubface is square to the Gutter at impact and you swung down any amount you have put hook spin on the ball.

 

[fbhillgartner]

What is the new idea underlying the D-plane concept? It seems that what Brian has described here is very similar to my understanding of the "old" ball flight laws. If you want to hook a shot, close the clubface and swing on an in to out path. If you want to cut a shot, open the clubface and swing on an out to in path.

 

[Damon Lucas]

Because...

If the above were true, the clubhead would be swinging down and OUT(ie in to out a few degrees) and coupled with a clubface/lie angle tool direction, the ball will start relatively close to 'on line' and then curve AWAY from the path.

 

[Ryan Smither]

"golf ball rolling down the roof" ... i like it ... much better than an ant on a hula hoop coupled with a tangent line ... ... mind if i borrow that one?

 

[fronesis]

picture your roof(assuming you don't have a flat roof). The gutter is the plane line and the roof is the plane angle. If you roll a ball straight down off of your roof it will go across the gutter and out in front of your house. That is the downward part of the swing. The more downward there is the further right the true club path is from the plane your swinging on. As long as the ball rolls down the roof any amount it will cross the gutter and go out to right field. So...if the clubface is square to the Gutter at impact and you swung down any amount you have put hook spin on the ball.

Nicely done, Tom! That's a very helpful image.

 

[Bigwill]

Quick question. Is the "down" achieved by actually hitting down, or is it a result of forward lean?

 

[tongzilla]

Quick question. Is the "down" achieved by actually hitting down, or is it a result of forward lean?

technically, the two are independent.

 

[tongzilla]

So if you set-up square, and swung perfectly on a plane, that had its base (the plane line) perfectly pointing to the target, and the face was square, you'd miss the target wide left.

You can hit a fade with this alignment, with a very open clubface.

The ball would start WAY, WAY right, and curve further that way.

Brian, disregarding extreme cases, there will always be a clubface direction (true face direction) that will get the ball to your desired location given the true path. This is true whether your clubhead path is a few degrees to the right or straight.

 

[Tom Bartlett]

technically, the two are independent.

Correct. You can hit up with a forward leaning shaft. that's one way to get really low spin numbers with a driver.