Michael Finney
New
the feet
Fixing TGM....(?)
- Thread starter birdie_man
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Steve Khatib
Super Moderator
YES Mike youre spot on, keep practicing on youre milk create.
Balance: feet always cancelling and sensing lag pressure also helps provide maximum swing radius. However uneducated hands can nullify it all if not suspected.
Balance: feet always cancelling and sensing lag pressure also helps provide maximum swing radius. However uneducated hands can nullify it all if not suspected.
Michael Finney said:
Damon Lucas
Super Moderator
Curriculum
G'day Steve,
How do you apply TGM in your teaching? By the book? More Doyle influenced? Manzella influenced?
G'day Steve,
How do you apply TGM in your teaching? By the book? More Doyle influenced? Manzella influenced?
Steve Khatib
Super Moderator
Hi Damon, great question it all depends on the students learning style and interlectual capacity. Generally my Asian juniors very much Doyle style, my analytical adults majority males also Doyle style and Joe Daniels by the book acedemia. My ladies and right brain males McHatton feel style.
And finally my blood money one off quick fix 'blood money' fix my throw away and slice with my driver or else in one hour and I dont want to chip and pitch first and they delibrately bring only their driver and 3 iron to the lesson(the majority of these people are ignorant pigs), what ever story they want to hear based on their friends ideas the latest magazine tip they read and their illusionary feels I sneak in a couple of components from the book from one or two of the three zones with out them knowing it!
Stay on plane Damon!
And finally my blood money one off quick fix 'blood money' fix my throw away and slice with my driver or else in one hour and I dont want to chip and pitch first and they delibrately bring only their driver and 3 iron to the lesson(the majority of these people are ignorant pigs), what ever story they want to hear based on their friends ideas the latest magazine tip they read and their illusionary feels I sneak in a couple of components from the book from one or two of the three zones with out them knowing it!
Stay on plane Damon!
homersson said:
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tongzilla
New
I am not exactly sure what Brian meant by "moving the club".
But there is no doubt that it is the Feet which begins the Downstroke (both Hitting and Swinging). That is what happens in all good strokes. Which body part the player tries to use to start the downstroke really has nothing to do what what actually happens, e.g. many people think about sliding/turning their hips, or moving their left knee, etc., even though in reality it is still the Feet that begins the Downstroke. Of course, the TGM folks will know that the most coordinated procedure is to use the Hands to start down.
But there is no doubt that it is the Feet which begins the Downstroke (both Hitting and Swinging). That is what happens in all good strokes. Which body part the player tries to use to start the downstroke really has nothing to do what what actually happens, e.g. many people think about sliding/turning their hips, or moving their left knee, etc., even though in reality it is still the Feet that begins the Downstroke. Of course, the TGM folks will know that the most coordinated procedure is to use the Hands to start down.
Perfect Impact
New
I disagree that the feet do the work to begin the stroke: I feel that like when someone dances, his feet are braces or contact points against the immovable surface, but it is the LEGS that control moving weight into the left side. The ankles flex to permit this easily and is why the ankle joints have the kind of ball joint that we experience for walking and rolling our feet; but the legs, as far as I can determine myself, are what enable me to move my center of mass. And THAT, the C/M is what powers my swing. Gravity Golf said this. Common sense proves it.
It's a Stimulus, Reaction , Responce.
It starts Together, With the Pivot. (heel to heel foot action)
The Stimilus starts with the throwing out (CW rotation of the radus and ulner right forarm) action of the Hands from the top.
The Members of the Body(including the Hands) React, "let loose" immediatly after being Triggered by that stimulation.
The Responce It the Strike or Kick that follows through the ball.
It has to begin at the top, with the hands, to get the club head to meet inline
At impact. As the clubhead has the widest Arc to describe within the swing. More Arc distance to travel.
That is Good as it lets you build Club Head Speed.
Centrifugal force is being used, let loose.
The small contracting centripital Stimulation is applied to the handle of the shaft at the transition. Then let the body reflex.
It starts Together, With the Pivot. (heel to heel foot action)
The Stimilus starts with the throwing out (CW rotation of the radus and ulner right forarm) action of the Hands from the top.
The Members of the Body(including the Hands) React, "let loose" immediatly after being Triggered by that stimulation.
The Responce It the Strike or Kick that follows through the ball.
It has to begin at the top, with the hands, to get the club head to meet inline
At impact. As the clubhead has the widest Arc to describe within the swing. More Arc distance to travel.
That is Good as it lets you build Club Head Speed.
Centrifugal force is being used, let loose.
The small contracting centripital Stimulation is applied to the handle of the shaft at the transition. Then let the body reflex.
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Steve Khatib
Super Moderator
Those who dont believe in the feet DO NOT UNDERSTAND LAG LOADING!
Brian Manzella
Administrator
Give that man a cigar!
You are 100% right Mr. Chris.
You are 100% right Mr. Chris.
four barrels said:Those who dont believe in the feet DO NOT UNDERSTAND LAG LOADING!
The 'farthest link in the chain' from the clubhead is the motivator for any given length motion. For a full swing, that is the feet. For a putt, it is 'up the chain'.
In either it is the seeking of balance, due to the effects of gravity, that start the 'fall' in a well timed motion.
Extending the swing radius to the feet - a critical lesson most certainly.
Brian Manzella
Administrator
Good Job, Ed.
You see Ed, I call 'em fair across the board.
You see Ed, I call 'em fair across the board.
ej20 said:
No its not "real" and it does not have a real "effect". Since its not real it cannot be used to explain the flail or anything else in the golf swing. That is where Homer misguides the reader. He uses a fictitious force to explain a complex subject which is wrong and a cop-out. Its like someone telling you Bernoulli's equation explains lift on an airplane wing. It easy to do, its flat out wrong and its done by teachers (who don't know what they are talking about) every day.
Only "real" forces can cause a mass to change direction and or to accelerate. This is Newton's second law. The only time it is ever approprate to use the term "centrifugal force" is when making calculations in rotating "non-inertial" coordinate system. Its a called a "non-inertial" coordinate system because by letting the axes' rotate inertia effects such as centripetal acceleration (which still exists btw) must be explained using a "fictitous" force. We call that fictitious force the centrifugal force. The words "centrifugal force" should never be used in the discussion of the golf swing. Bbeing wrong about basic physics diminishs TGM's repect in the eyes of the golfing community at large... it makes TGM laughable.
You are also wrong when you say the principle of interia does not hold true in circular motion. The only time any of Newton's laws begin to break down is when velocities begin to approach the speed of light.
PS.
BM... I don't do quizes.
birdie_man
New
TGM laughable!
Hahaha ahhahahahahahha....
That statement is what's laughable!!!!
(laughter)
...
K...
If you said "That concept is laughable...." or "It makes certain things laughable..."
Ok I have no beef.
...
That (part of your) post was laughable.
...
I don't want to get too "TGM is the bible" on you.....but man.....
...well....I'll just stop myself and say TGM isn't laughable by any stretch.
Hahaha ahhahahahahahha....
That statement is what's laughable!!!!
(laughter)
...
K...
If you said "That concept is laughable...." or "It makes certain things laughable..."
Ok I have no beef.
...
That (part of your) post was laughable.
...
I don't want to get too "TGM is the bible" on you.....but man.....
...well....I'll just stop myself and say TGM isn't laughable by any stretch.
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Brian Manzella
Administrator
Hey pal!
That's because you can't beat me.
Undefeated and still Champion of the World!
The Italian Stallion.....
nmgolfer said:
That's because you can't beat me.
Undefeated and still Champion of the World!
The Italian Stallion.....
swingeasttowest
New
Stand still and then begin to walk. What moves first???
Tom Bartlett
Administrator
I just got in from the bars. Forget standing still. I'm laying still and everything is moving.swingeasttowest said:
nmgolfer said:
You will have to direct me to a suitable authority that says fictitious forces does not have a real effect.
Circular motion can only be analysed in a non-inertial frame of reference.In theory,the object in question is never in a state of inertia when it is travelling in a circular motion and thus,the law of inertia does not even apply.Only newtons 3rd law applies.Even if it is travelling at a constant velocity,it is constantly changing directions and is considered "accelerating" because velocity needs a direction as well as speed.This accelerating frame of reference is what "causes" this fictitious force.The effect is real just like gravity.
Newtons laws are flawed and his principle of inertia has been superseeded by Einsteins geodesic curvature.You are not entirely correct when you say Newtons laws ONLY break down approaching light speed.They become more innacurate as speeds get higher but the inaccuracies at slower speeds are still good enough to send a probe to pluto.
If you really want to discuss fictitious forces then perhaps you need to visit a physics forum,not a golf forum.We are not physicists..we are golfers.Maybe you will get a better debate there.
ej20 said:
"You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink"
You will have to lead yourself. Take personal responsibility... Try a university curriculum in either engineering or physics of course you will have to graduate from highschool before the consider admiting you. I don't spoon feed.
ej20 said:
Thats what those in the know call pure unadulterated hogwash. Circular motion can be analyzed in ANY repeat ANY frame of reference.
ej20 said:
In who's theory? Yours? Got knews... Inertia is a property of all matter. If it has mass it has inertia. Just because you calculating in a non-inertial reference frame does not mean inertia suddenly disappears. All of Newton's laws apply. The ONLY time they begin to break down is when velocities begin to approach the speed of light. That ONLY happens at the sub-atomic and or intergalactic travel levels. While gravity is real and everyone (sans perhaps you) agree is fully explained via Newtonian physics (I refer you to his universal law of gravitation), Homers's fiction (lets call it Homer's folly) is not real and has no really effect.
Now I ask you in all seriousness... Where are you getting this stuff? I have to wonder... is our education system really that flawed?
ej20 said:
Need I remind you that this thread is about the physics of the golf swing? Seeing how your experience have not equiped to comment intelligently on such things perhaps you should confine yourself to theads in which fanciful ideas that not linked to sound scientific thought process are expounded to explain what happens in the golf swing. That leaves you.... well the rest of this forum doesn't it.
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