Flipp'n examples

[curtisj76]

If someone has the time and knows the difference, can you show examples of someone that flips it bad, times the flip, and how it's supposed to be done (no flip). I've seen videos of golfers who supposedly time the flip but to me I don't see it. I think if we can come up with these 3 examples it would help a lot of members see the difference and learn from it. Thanks

Curtis

 

[Richie3Jack]

Here's a pic of me timing the flip. Tough to see the clubshaft because it's a black graphite shaft, but look down by my left foot and you can see.

And here's me from yesterday.

3JACK

 

[suns11111]

Nice examples 3Jack! This goes in my COFF bookmark!
JeffS

 

[curtisj76]

So what's the difference between your 2 photo's? I can't tell.

 

[jaridyard]

A 'could it get any worse' flip to a....

 

[Richie3Jack]

Non-flip pic = straight line from left arm down to the club shaft.

Flipping Pic = clubshaft is at an angle from the left arm.


In the pic with the split frame, it's easy to tell. In the pics of myself, it's only difficult to tell because it's hard to see the clubshaft.

These links provide bigger pics of myself and should help you see the clubshaft a little better.

(Flip Pic)
*****http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_vxK8voNhgdU/Sgy9YLTU-cI/AAAAAAAAAZM/78A28mU4NCM/s1600-h/old+impact.jpg *********

(Non-Flip Pic)
****http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_vxK8voNhgdU/SjcVbXvz93I/AAAAAAAAAcU/ruTtf7wWE34/s1600-h/twistaway.jpg **********





3JACK

 

[Frizit]

You should tell that inconsiderate lady to get her shadow out of your box. I'd have went apeshit if she was standing beside me like that.

 

[willgolfer]

Non-flip pic = straight line from left arm down to the club shaft.

Flipping Pic = clubshaft is at an angle from the left arm.

3JACK

where is that golf course? nice backdrop.

 

[Shot Limit]

<a href="http://s614.photobucket.com/albums/tt227/ShotLimit/?action=view&current=Flippin.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i614.photobucket.com/albums/tt227/ShotLimit/Flippin.jpg" border="0" alt="golf,golf"></a>

 

[Richie3Jack]

where is that golf course? nice backdrop.

First pic of me is at Hamilton Mill Golf Club in Dacula, GA. The second pic of me is at Olde Atlanta Golf Club in Suwanee, GA. Both are just outside of Atlanta. Didn't even notice the woman's shadow. Given how packed those ranges are and how inconsiderate most people are, that stuff doesn't bother me much anymore. I'm just happy when I don't get shanked into.



3JACK

 

[Drew_MN]

3JACK

you named 'twistaway' in your pic w/ no flip. Does that determine degree of flip that occurs? Do you apply full wedding ring up? or to a degree less twistaway or more a horizontal hinge?

I ask because i feel like for me the hinge action allows a flip. If i apply a horizontal hinge I dont see how its possible to flip is all. Am i on right track?

 

[Richie3Jack]

3JACK

you named 'twistaway' in your pic w/ no flip. Does that determine degree of flip that occurs? Do you apply full wedding ring up? or to a degree less twistaway or more a horizontal hinge?

I ask because i feel like for me the hinge action allows a flip. If i apply a horizontal hinge I dont see how its possible to flip is all. Am i on right track?

For the most part, I don't flip anymore. I took some video of 20 swings on Monday and only one did I flip. At 95%, I'll take it.

The twistaway isn't about flipping or not flipping, it's about clubface and D-Plane. It's exactly as Brian describes in the title of the video NEVER SLICE AGAIN. I do that, I ain't slicing. I use it only about 5 times a round if I need a big draw/hook or if the shot calls for no left-to-right action. I live in Atlanta and it's pretty hilly up here and the architects are smart enough to put water on the right side when they know you're going to get a downhill and/or ball below your feet type of lie.

It's actually very easy to flip with horizontal hinge, but the twistaway does some things that I like (getting the golfer more of a 'drive the ball into the ground instead of driving it into the air' type of motion and a proper swivel). I actually don't think too much about the wedding ring up, although that's a good thought. I think more or getting my palm down towards the ground, sort of like dribbling a basketball, at the impact/release stage.

But, I've got plenty of pics of me not flipping using angled hinge. This one is my favorite because the sun is just right were you can see the clubshaft easily.

But different things work for different people. The downswing twistaway is more of a 'specialty shot' for my game, but I'm sure glad I have it in my arsenal.




3JACK

 

[Drew_MN]

That pic looks solid. Almost looks as if you can really see shaft flex back towards target after hit....You say you dont flip anymore, what got you away from it? Is there a certain feel? One of the PP's over another? I feel like Im there, but Ive had so many times where I think Ive beat the flip move and a nope there it is. So doubting myself a bit I guess. Lately, however, I feel like Ive gotten beat anyhow. I just cant validate. I will take some video here soon to see.

 

[Richie3Jack]

That pic looks solid. Almost looks as if you can really see shaft flex back towards target after hit....You say you dont flip anymore, what got you away from it? Is there a certain feel? One of the PP's over another? I feel like Im there, but Ive had so many times where I think Ive beat the flip move and a nope there it is. So doubting myself a bit I guess. Lately, however, I feel like Ive gotten beat anyhow. I just cant validate. I will take some video here soon to see.

The tough part is you have to find what works for you. Go see an instructor like Brian and you'll get your answer, at least eventually if you work at it.

For me, it was understanding what Homer Kelley meant when he said you should learn 'feel from mechanics.' I actually understood it by accident, when I was trying to stop coming OTT after a week long layoff from the game. And then I wound up improving my downswing once I understood learning feel from mechanics and I stopped coming OTT. Then I worked on a drill for the flip and just 'felt my way around' and suddenly I understood it. The contact, ball flight and sound were all different and then I checked it out on the camcorder and I was in a similar position.

I do recommend the Taly training aid. After having to take a couple of weeks off I started flipping again and the Taly got me out of it within about 50 balls on the range. Now I use it every practice session, even before I go out and play. It's funny because the other day somebody asked 'don't you think you're being too technical before around?' And I had to tell him there was nothing technical about it, I'm just trying to get the feel I'm looking for. If I didn't have the Taly on and said I was looking to get the right feel, everbody would rave at how 'natural' that is. All I'm doing with the Taly is speeding up the process.




3JACK

 

[curtisj76]

Ok, how about some swings now as that's where I have the most difficulty. I'll start with a video that Pecky actually posted (not him I don't think) where this guy timed the flip. I just don't see what's wrong with the swing and I have a feeling I'm not much different than this guy.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_wU76xMknY&NR=1[/media]

 

[needham]

are those capri pants??????

 

[curtisj76]

are those capri pants??????

yeah yeah yeah, stick to the subject!

 

[fronesis]

Ok, how about some swings now as that's where I have the most difficulty. I'll start with a video that Pecky actually posted (not him I don't think) where this guy timed the flip. I just don't see what's wrong with the swing and I have a feeling I'm not much different than this guy.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_wU76xMknY&NR=1[/media]

YES, I'd call that a BAD case of timing the flip.

What's wrong with it?

Well, there might not be ANYTHING wrong with the PARTICULAR shot that he just hit. But go play golf with this guy for 4 or 5 rounds, and make sure there's someone in your foursome for those rounds who does NOT flip it.

Then observe the following:

• the flipper's scores are all over the map compared to the non-flipper, even if they have similar handicaps
• the flipper is more likely to hit a hideous shot than the non-flipper
• given similar size and swing type, the non-flipper hits it further
• the flipper panics when he has a bad lie while the non-flipper just hits down on it with his pivot

If none of that convinces you, then just LISTEN to the flipper hit the ball, and then LISTEN to a pro hit the ball. The flipper's shot probably sounds like every average amateur golfer's shot; but listen to a pro hit a 7 iron and it sounds like a gun went off.

As everyone has said before, you can play scratch golf with a flip, so you may not want to worry about it. Part of it depends on what your goals are.

Do you want to play golf under pressure (even if only in friendly local tournaments)? If so, I HIGHLY recommend a swing without a flip. And this is especially true if you can't play every day. Flippers rely on timing and their swings are more easily exposed by lay-offs and by the pressure of competition.

 

[curtisj76]

I know flipping is "wrong", my question is I can't visually see the flip? These non-expert eyes just don't see a flip. Does someone have a video of a swing (similar view) we can put side by side or something? Sorry to be a pain, but there's got to be some others like me.

 

[cmartingolf]

Good post

YES, I'd call that a BAD case of timing the flip.

What's wrong with it?

Well, there might not be ANYTHING wrong with the PARTICULAR shot that he just hit. But go play golf with this guy for 4 or 5 rounds, and make sure there's someone in your foursome for those rounds who does NOT flip it.

Then observe the following:

• the flipper's scores are all over the map compared to the non-flipper, even if they have similar handicaps
• the flipper is more likely to hit a hideous shot than the non-flipper
• given similar size and swing type, the non-flipper hits it further
• the flipper panics when he has a bad lie while the non-flipper just hits down on it with his pivot

If none of that convinces you, then just LISTEN to the flipper hit the ball, and then LISTEN to a pro hit the ball. The flipper's shot probably sounds like every average amateur golfer's shot; but listen to a pro hit a 7 iron and it sounds like a gun went off.

As everyone has said before, you can play scratch golf with a flip, so you may not want to worry about it. Part of it depends on what your goals are.

Do you want to play golf under pressure (even if only in friendly local tournaments)? If so, I HIGHLY recommend a swing without a flip. And this is especially true if you can't play every day. Flippers rely on timing and their swings are more easily exposed by lay-offs and by the pressure of competition.

Don't forget...the non-flipper loves the wind because the The flipper hates the wind and usually can't compete.