Flying Wedges....

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Mathew

Banned
Heres a picture showing the plane of motion of the left wrist cock and right wrist bend. Notice how the two 'planes of motion' are intersecting at 90 degrees. The left wrist cocks (vertical) and the right wrist bends back (horizontal).

Wedge.gif


So the entire left arm and clubshaft forms one wedge. The right forearm and the clubshaft (angled extension of the clubshaft) is the other.
 
P

Powerdraw

New
quote:Originally posted by Mathew

Heres a picture showing the plane of motion of the left wrist cock and right wrist bend. Notice how the two 'planes of motion' are intersecting at 90 degrees. The left wrist cocks (vertical) and the right wrist bends back (horizontal).

So the entire left arm and clubshaft forms one wedge. The right forearm and the clubshaft (angled extension of the clubshaft) is the other.
Click to expand...

nice...real nice...
 
H

holenone

Banned
quote:Originally posted by Mathew

Heres a picture showing the plane of motion of the left wrist cock and right wrist bend. Notice how the two 'planes of motion' are intersecting at 90 degrees. The left wrist cocks (vertical) and the right wrist bends back (horizontal).

Wedge.gif


So the entire left arm and clubshaft forms one wedge. The right forearm and the clubshaft (angled extension of the clubshaft) is the other.
Click to expand...

Another good visual, Mathew. Thanks.

However, there is a lesson to be learned here. In order to maintain the Right Forearm Flying Wedge, the Impact Fix degree of Bend in your Right Wrist -- once established -- must remain constant. That being the case, you must activate the Club via the Right Forearm.

In your video, this is not happening. Instead, your Right Forearm has remained stationary, and you have activated the Club by simply increasing the amount of Bend in the Backstroke and then decreasing it in the Downstroke. In other words, you are Bending and Flattening what should be a Motionless Right Wrist. In so doing, you have changed your Clubface alignment throughout the Stroke.

The correct procedure is to establish the desired degree of Right Wrist Bend and then take the entire Right Forearm Flying Wedge back with your Right Forearm and deliver it through with your Right Forearm, leaving the Right Wrist Bend constant.

Learn to do that, my young friend, and we'll be tuning in on Sunday afternoons to watch you lift trophies!
 
R

Ringer

New
Holenone... I have had much trouble with the right wrist bending aspect of the backswing in that I have always said the wrist BEND is an effect of the position of the right forearm to the left hand. I've been ridiculed for that time and time again... yet here it is. The same thing I've been saying and something that I derived from TGM the same as you just stated. That angers me, and I think it should anger you. Here I am stating something which is proper, even in TGM, and people fight me tooth and nail yelling as loudly as they can "The Right wrist bends, the right wrist bends!!". I tell them you don't FORCE the bend, it happens because of the right forearm and they continue to tell me I'm wrong.

mb6606 - I believe Holenone is more concerned about the emphasis of the FOREARM making the motion instead of the hand. The hands should only act to hold onto the club. It's our conciousness of the feel gained through the hands which make them "educated".
 
R

Ringer

New
BTW.. Thank you matthew.. that helps with the wedges. Any chance you can do something to show the right forearm distinctions made in 7-3?
 
A

Arizonian

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I see alot of pro's start the takeway with the right wrist bend (Ernie, Tiger, etc.), this happens before the forearm even moves. So I see how one could say the right wrist bend is 'forced'. I prefer to say the swing is anniatiated with the right wrist bend. This feels natural to me
 
R

Ringer

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Arizonian - How do you KNOW they start it back with an intention to bend the right wrist? The movement of the club while keeping the right forearm in the same locaion will force the wrist to bend. Is it the chicken or the egg?
 
M

Mathew

Banned
Hey dudes - thanks for the interest in the thread....

Holenone/YODA :) always a pleasure and I understand EXACTLY what you are saying and it feels very good to have it confirmed by someone of your standing and knowledge. And yup your right about the picture. The picture I provided, was only to serve the purpose to demonstrate how the left cock and right wrist bend planes intersect at 90 degrees... something I just didn't get for a long while.... the incubator is a mysterious thing :)
 
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mb6606

New
Why not just start in impact fix position. Lift your flying wedge up with your right forearm (maintain flat left frozen right wrist), lead the downsing with the hands and beat the $%#@ out of the ball. Educate those hands!
After 6 months of TGM study/practice it is finally coming together for me. Can it be this simple??

Now back to my trusty dowels with images of paddle wheels rolling down the river.
 
R

ryantiff

New
I have this problem too. At impact fix, left wrist flat, right wrist bend, right forearm takeaway, but the problem is I feel the right wrist bend more going back, and at the top (actually end) my clubshaft is parallel to the target line, I am doing the hitting procedure, therefore I should have the clubshaft more up, right. I am now trying to not have the right wrist more bent going back with the right forearm. It feels odd. Is this correct?
 
rwh

rwh

New
quote:Originally posted by Ringer

Holenone... I have had much trouble with the right wrist bending aspect of the backswing in that I have always said the wrist BEND is an effect of the position of the right forearm to the left hand. I've been ridiculed for that time and time again... yet here it is. The same thing I've been saying and something that I derived from TGM the same as you just stated. That angers me, and I think it should anger you. Here I am stating something which is proper, even in TGM, and people fight me tooth and nail yelling as loudly as they can "The Right wrist bends, the right wrist bends!!". I tell them you don't FORCE the bend, it happens because of the right forearm and they continue to tell me I'm wrong.

mb6606 - I believe Holenone is more concerned about the emphasis of the FOREARM making the motion instead of the hand. The hands should only act to hold onto the club. It's our conciousness of the feel gained through the hands which make them "educated".

hi-lited emphasis by rwh
Click to expand...

Ringer,

Yes; and one need only to move the ball position forward and backward to see the effect that has on the amount of Right Wrist bend without the player consciously adjusting it.

However, I think Holenone was simply stating that once the bent Right Wrist is established, the clubshaft is moved only with the Forearm.

This is simple for players who start up from Impact Fix, since the correct amount of Right Wrist bend is established and they need only maintain it while the Forearm does its Magic.

However, there are those who start up from Classic Address, where the wrist conditions are reversed (Left Wrist bent, Right Wrist flat). Those players need to get the right wrist set somewhere during the swing, which may be early, middle or late. I think those players can use different ways to set the wrist; but, once set, it's all Forearm.
 
H

holenone

Banned
quote:Originally posted by Arizonian

I see alot of pro's start the takeway with the right wrist bend (Ernie, Tiger, etc.), this happens before the forearm even moves. So I see how one could say the right wrist bend is 'forced'. I prefer to say the swing is initiated with the right wrist bend. This feels natural to me.
Click to expand...

Yes, this Right Wrist move from the Classic Address Flat condition to its Impact Bent Condition is widely used, and it is the result of an Extensor Action Takeaway (6-B-1-D). Simultaneously, the Extensor Action 'stretch' of the Left Arm results in a Left Wrist that moves from the Classic Address Bent condition to its Impact Flat Condition.
 
H

holenone

Banned
quote:Originally posted by mb6606

Holeone,
The clip shows the right wrist bend and then loops back to the beginning. I do not think Mathew is indicating the down swing.
Doesn't get much simpler than Craig Stadler
http://redgoat.smugmug.com/gallery/136421/1/9200389
Click to expand...

Yes, I think you're right. I was pre-conditioned to see it as a variation of my drill that presets the wedges in their Fix alignments and then has the Right Forearm Wedge move away from and then back to those Fix alignments.

A very effective drill, I might add!
 
H

holenone

Banned
quote:Originally posted by ryantiff

I have this problem too. At impact fix, left wrist flat, right wrist bend, right forearm takeaway, but the problem is I feel the right wrist bend more going back, and at the top (actually end) my clubshaft is parallel to the target line, I am doing the hitting procedure, therefore I should have the clubshaft more up, right. I am now trying to not have the right wrist more bent going back with the right forearm. It feels odd. Is this correct?
Click to expand...

Yes, you're absolutely on the right track. Set your Frozen Bent Right Wrist at Fix; take it up with your Right Forearm; and Drive it through Impact with the heel of your Right Hand against your Left hand thumb. And as a Hitter, you should avoid the Backstroke's End position. If you go past Top -- the Hands On Plane at the Right Shoulder -- you're past 'the point of no return' and will find it difficult not to Swing.
 
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swingeasttowest

New
Remember to avoid slack. As Holenone states "Extensor Action". So while thinking about the right forearm takeaway, don't forget to bring the left side with it..................
 
R

rundmc

Banned
Hey guys! For clarification please . . .

Impact Fix: Set up left arm flying wedge and right forearm flying wedge. Establish amount of knee bend needed.

Adjusted Address: Move body back from impact conditions to address conditions leaving impact wrist conditions in tact

Is this correct?

Also, I understand that playing from fix while employing hitting procedures is ok.

BUT is there any problem with beginning from fix while swinging? If there are negatives to doing this what are they?

It just seems to me you can eliminate variables and extra motions by beginning at fix. Seems like a lot of things are set up at fix. Take the grip at fix. Set up the wedges at fix. Why not start from fix?

Thanks!

Richard
 
A

Arizonian

New
quote:Originally posted by Ringer

Arizonian - How do you KNOW they start it back with an intention to bend the right wrist? The movement of the club while keeping the right forearm in the same locaion will force the wrist to bend. Is it the chicken or the egg?
Click to expand...

Ringer, YOU are the MACHINE, the club is dead. The right wrist moves the club, not the club moving the right wrist. Thus the movement of the club comes from the right wrist bend followed by the right forearm takeaway.
 
rwh

rwh

New
quote:Originally posted by Arizonian

quote:Originally posted by Ringer

Arizonian - How do you KNOW they start it back with an intention to bend the right wrist? The movement of the club while keeping the right forearm in the same locaion will force the wrist to bend. Is it the chicken or the egg?
Click to expand...

Ringer, YOU are the MACHINE, the club is dead. The right wrist moves the club, not the club moving the right wrist. Thus the movement of the club comes from the right wrist bend followed by the right forearm takeaway.

(bold added by rwh)
Click to expand...


You do not have to move the club with the Right Wrist if you start from Impact Fix. Many players start from Fix.
 
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